Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Gifts and supplies for the musician
SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
Ad (Piano Sing)
How to Make Your Piano Sing
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pianoteq
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
Who's Online
136 registered (Alexander Borro, Almaviva, 36251, ajames, 40 invisible), 1525 Guests and 16 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Pianos
Topic Options
#669881 - 08/21/04 10:08 PM is an electric keyboard the way to go?
DSWills Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/21/04
Posts: 30
I've been thinking a bit about graduating high school. While it is a few years away, I'll still be playing the piano then. However, I'm not sure whether or not actually renting/buying a piano for college is a good idea.

Obviously, it takes up too much space, is inconvenient to move, and (if I actually bought one) I need special movers to disassemble and reassemble it when if I move.

An electric keyboard is a lot more portable, and a lot smaller than a full grand piano. And, of course, whenever I settle down, I'll buy a real piano. But for college, is an electric keyboard the way to go? If so, are there any recommendations?

Thanks!

Top
(ads) Sweetwater / Roland
Your Next Keyboard is at Sweetwater

Click Here


#669882 - 08/22/04 03:06 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
I'm a professional player and I own (at the moment) three electric pianos. My practice piano is a Yamaha GranTouch (GT1) which uses a real grand piano action. The benefits of an electric piano (with a good action) out number the disadvantages. For one thing, you can play any time of the day or night using headphones and the piano is always in tune.

There are a lot of models from which to chose and I would advise going to a large store and spend an afternoon trying them out. Bring along a set of headphones so you can better compare the various piano samples.

Also consider the option of renting a piano.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669883 - 08/22/04 09:34 PM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Kenpcola Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/07/04
Posts: 86
Loc: Pensacola, FL
hi there,
Just a clarification. are you looking for a synthesizer(digital keyboard) or digital piano?
(they are not called electric pianos though)
If you plan to play piano, you may buy a digital piano. And it is THE way to go for college life. Forget buying or renting acoustic for few years.. you can always play one at your school(most schools have many real pianos). Use digital one for practice as you wish. I may not make decision to choose the one till I know the college setting though. If you can play real acoustic grand at next door student common most of the time, why bother buying one?

Top
#669884 - 08/23/04 10:44 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
ryan Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/04/01
Posts: 1995
Loc: Colorado
As a classical pianist I *have* to practice on a real piano. Digitals respond nothing like pianos and any time I spend "practicing" classical music on digital pianos is time wasted for me. However, for pop, easy listening, and rock styles a digital piano is fine and in fact I use one at home and when I play live. So, I can't really advise you one way or the other. You'll have to make the call based on your own needs.

Ryan

Top
#669885 - 08/23/04 10:46 PM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Hammerklavier Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/12/03
Posts: 46
What Ryan said. If you are playing classical, an accoustic piano is the only way to go.

Top
#669886 - 08/24/04 02:09 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
 Quote:
Originally posted by Hammerklavier:
What Ryan said. If you are playing classical, an accoustic piano is the only way to go. [/b]
I disagree. There are several models offered by Yamaha that use a 'real' action. I practice on a GranTouch 1 which uses a real grand action (from a six footer I'm told) and it responds exactly as I expect it to.

Here's a link to the GranTouch page at Yamaha's wweb site ... http://www.yamaha.co.jp/english/product/piano/product/europe/gt/gt.html

I traded in my six foot grand years ago and bought this GranTouch because I can now play as hard as I want but the sound is as soft as I wish (I have tinnitus). I can also use headphones ... and the piano is _always_ prefectly in tune.

Yamaha also makes an upright version which also uses a 'real' upright action.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669887 - 08/24/04 05:54 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
SteveY Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/06/01
Posts: 1820
Loc: NJ
The GranTouch may have the action of an acoustic piano, but the sound engine is still only capable of 128 levels (at best) of dynamics. That's where digital pianos fall short ultimately.
_________________________
PianoWorld disclaimer: musician, producer, arranger, author, clinician, consultant, PS2 aficionado, secret agent...

Top
#669888 - 08/24/04 06:32 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
ryan Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/04/01
Posts: 1995
Loc: Colorado
I am very familiar with the GranTouch and it has the same limitiations as all digital pianos. Like Steve said, it is 128 level limited.

Polyphony is always a limitation, and the GranTouch only has 32 note stereo polyphony, which is a serious limitation in any style, not just classical. I found that when I practiced on keyboards with 32 note polyphony my pedal technique went bad because you don't really even need to clean the pedal.

More limitations include the lack of any real range of color. The best have 4 sample layers at most and I have yet to play one where the response of color over a range of dynamic levels was anything like a real piano. The GranTouch probably has 3 layers at the most, given that it only has a 30Meg sample ROM memory. Dynamic range is obviously better than the color range being a lot easier for the manufacturer to implement. However, the dynamic curve is never right on digitals, and part of the reason is the lack of color. On a real piano the choice of dynamic level is often driven by the desired color. On a digital the careful choice of dynamic level is pointless due to the lack of color. The pedals never respond like a real piano, making it impossible to use classical pedalling techniques. Finally, no matter what digital pianos always have that "amplifier/speaker" sound.

Dispite the above limitations, I still use digitals and think they can be very useful tools. But they aren't really anything like the real thing. Actually, I would choose a real piano over a digital anytime a nice one was available, but only if mic'ing, bleed, feedback, and monitoring weren't issues.

Ryan

Top
#669889 - 08/25/04 12:50 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
 Quote:
Originally posted by SteveY:
The GranTouch may have the action of an acoustic piano, but the sound engine is still only capable of 128 levels (at best) of dynamics. That's where digital pianos fall short ultimately. [/b]
Steve, believe it or not, 128 levels (at best) are _more than enough_ to recreate the experience of imitating a real piano. Throwing numbers around might sound good in an argument, but as a professional pianist (one who have made a living solely from playing), I can assure you the GranTouch as well as most, if not all digital pianos I have played, are not the source of the limitation - the player is, not the piano.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669890 - 08/25/04 12:57 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
This to add ... I would be willing to bet a substantial amount of money that if a GranTouch piano were recorded (and ambient room noise were added for 'realism' - pedaling noise, chair squeaking, player moaning, etc.), listeners would be hard pressed to discern whether or not the 'piano' they were listening to were 'real' or not.

I've recorded my GT1 and it sounds like a piano to me.

If your remarks re digital and acoustic are valid, a simple listening test would be the proof, correct?
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669891 - 08/25/04 05:45 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
SteveY Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/06/01
Posts: 1820
Loc: NJ
 Quote:
Steve, believe it or not, 128 levels (at best) are _more than enough_ to recreate the experience of imitating a real piano. Throwing numbers around might sound good in an argument, but as a professional pianist (one who have made a living solely from playing), I can assure you the GranTouch as well as most, if not all digital pianos I have played, are not the source of the limitation - the player is, not the piano.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I too, make my living solely from music. I think 128 levels is limiting. But perhaps more limiting is the lack of timbral response from digitals as most have only 3 or 4 velocity-switched sample layers. But don't get me wrong -- I'm very much into electronics. I have a lot of synth gear. In fact, right now I'm quite captivated by virtual instruments. But I still think there's no comparison when it comes to digital vs. acoustic (even the GranTouch).
_________________________
PianoWorld disclaimer: musician, producer, arranger, author, clinician, consultant, PS2 aficionado, secret agent...

Top
#669892 - 08/25/04 06:06 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
netizen Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/02/01
Posts: 1926
Loc: New York
 Quote:
Originally posted by DSWills:
I've been thinking a bit about graduating high school. While it is a few years away, I'll still be playing the piano then. However, I'm not sure whether or not actually renting/buying a piano for college is a good idea.

Obviously, it takes up too much space, is inconvenient to move, and (if I actually bought one) I need special movers to disassemble and reassemble it when if I move.

An electric keyboard is a lot more portable, and a lot smaller than a full grand piano. And, of course, whenever I settle down, I'll buy a real piano. But for college, is an electric keyboard the way to go? If so, are there any recommendations?

Thanks! [/b]
As a student, I think it can make sense to use a digital keyboard (in addition to using a piano found in a practice room on campus). You can find digitals will hold in you, imo, in good shape thru most basic things. A Yamaha P80 or 120 would do nicely. If you're computer savy, however, I would dump that idea and get a good weighted controller and a piano sample library (there are many of them to choose from) for use with Gigastudio.The quality of the sound, imo, is vastly superior to what you'll find on a pre-canned digital and, plus, you can always use tweak it. Just my .02. Good luck.

N.
_________________________
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."-- Theodore Roosevelt

Top
#669893 - 08/25/04 06:58 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
ryan Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/04/01
Posts: 1995
Loc: Colorado
 Quote:
Originally posted by Dave Horne:
This to add ... I would be willing to bet a substantial amount of money that if a GranTouch piano were recorded (and ambient room noise were added for 'realism' - pedaling noise, chair squeaking, player moaning, etc.), listeners would be hard pressed to discern whether or not the 'piano' they were listening to were 'real' or not.

I've recorded my GT1 and it sounds like a piano to me.

If your remarks re digital and acoustic are valid, a simple listening test would be the proof, correct?
[/b]
What does recording the piano have anything to do with it? I thought the original poster was looking for a practice piano to keep in his dorm. In that context I stand by my comments - a digital piano is not a sutable instrument for a serious classical musician, especially if they intend to perform on real pianos.

As for being able to tell whether a recorded piano is real or not, I think it is besides the point. In blind listening tests people who don't know the kind of piano still hear the limitations in the performance. What they do hear is a lack of nuance, detail, color, expression, and depth of tone. Only they tend to blame it on the recording and/or the performer. Also, people can generally hear strangeness in the sound engine if they are at all savy about how real pianos sound. Even little things like the amplitude envelope (which is never right) and the dropout of notes in dense sections due to polyphony limitations can be clearly heard. People tend to describe these as "weird" sounding, even if they don't know what is really going on. CDs of digital pianos don't tend to stay in the changer for very long.

Top
#669894 - 08/25/04 08:12 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
My point was ... several points actually, I feel a GranTouch piano (a piano with a real piano action) would be adequate for a student studying classical piano. If I had to choose between an acoustic upright and a GranTouch (either the upright or grand flavor), I'd choose the GranTouch.

The 'limitation' of 128 velocity levels AFAIC is a non issue. I doubt anyone can play with 128 levels of graduation so that issue is moot. (Try that yourself - play as softly as you can and keep playing louder. How many levels can you play?) My mentioning of a comparison between an acoustic piano and a sampled piano (which has to be listened to with speakers or headphones to keep the playing field, as it were, level) was to make the point that if you can't hear the difference between a recording of an acoustic piano and a sampled piano, perhaps there isn't a difference.

If the student can afford the money and space for a concert grand, go with a concert grand. If money and space are an issue, a sampled piano with a real grand action is a good alternative (plus you can practice at 3AM using headphones and the piano is always perfectly in tune).
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669895 - 08/25/04 08:19 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
ryan Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/04/01
Posts: 1995
Loc: Colorado
I forgot the other bit of digital strangeness that can be heard, and that's the looping of the samples. It really messes up the long decays and sustained notes because the change in color is not captured, not to mention the fact that the same sample is repeated over and over.

I would go with an acoustic vertical over a digital any day. With the acoustic vertical one can still learn all aspects of good technique and tone production on a real piano. Techniques learned when playing a digital, any digital, do not translate to real pianos. I know this from experience.

Top
#669896 - 08/25/04 09:19 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
My GranTouch is six years old or so and I do not hear any looping of the samples - that's pretty old technology by today's standards. I also do not hear looping on my P250.

I will agree to disagree with you regarding your statement - Techniques learned when playing a digital, any digital, do not translate to real pianos. I know this from experience.

I have no problems translating my playing from my GranTouch to a nine foot Steinway. Most of my jobs are on acoustic pianos and I have never felt disadvantaged from having practiced on a sampled piano with a real grand action. Perhaps you're a better player than I.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669897 - 08/25/04 09:31 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
Ryan, your mention of 'tone production', could you elaborate on that. Apart from pedaling techniques (which are roughly the same on both digital and acoustic pianos), what are you specifically referring to.

The same amount of force (velocity) creates the same exact sound on an acoustic or digital piano - it doesn't matter if 250 grams of force comes from my finger, my cat or my nose.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669898 - 08/25/04 09:45 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Roxane Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/16/02
Posts: 932
I don't think a college student could afford a GranTouch; the same amount of money will get a very nice upright. Anyway, if it is just for recreational playing, a decent digital will suffice. Unless he is a piano major, I'm sure there are more pressing things to master at college.

Top
#669899 - 08/25/04 10:31 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
ryan Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/04/01
Posts: 1995
Loc: Colorado
 Quote:
Originally posted by Dave Horne:
Ryan, your mention of 'tone production', could you elaborate on that. Apart from pedaling techniques (which are roughly the same on both digital and acoustic pianos), what are you specifically referring to.

The same amount of force (velocity) creates the same exact sound on an acoustic or digital piano - it doesn't matter if 250 grams of force comes from my finger, my cat or my nose. [/b]
You are wrong. the fact that you can't hear the difference doesn't mean that others can't. I know many people who are not pianists or audio engineers who can clearly hear the difference between a real piano and a digital piano. There is no need for me to explain the differences again.

To be honest, I think your assertion that a digital piano sounds exactly the same as a real piano defies logic, especially in the face of all the real differences I described above. How could they possibly sound the same given all of the differences? Maybe you've fooled yourself out of all objectivity?

Ryan

Top
#669900 - 08/25/04 11:51 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
Ryan,
You wrote: With the acoustic vertical one can still learn all aspects of good technique and tone production on a real piano. [end quote]

Using just _acoustic pianos_ for this discussion, what do you mean by tone production? The only control the player has on an acoustic piano's tone comes down to velocity (and pedal technique). What exactly do you mean 'with the acoustic vertical one can still learn all aspects of good technique and tone production on a real piano.'

Apart from pedaling, tone production is simply a product of velocity - how lightly or heavily one strikes the key.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669901 - 08/25/04 05:07 PM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
ryan Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/04/01
Posts: 1995
Loc: Colorado
I'm sorry, I misunderstood your question and went off on a rant *sheepish grin*.

Tone production is a matter of carefully balancing the dynamic level and color of the notes both horizontally and vertically. It isn't about the tone of one single note out of context, but it is entirely about the tone of each and every note in the context of the big picture.

For example, when I voice a chord I usually want the top note to ring out a bit more, so I make it a tad bit louder by slightly shifting the corresponding finger. On a real piano the slightly increased dynamic level of the note will also make it a tad bit brighter and the combination of the two helps it to sing out.

Now that chord is usually surrounded by other notes, probably chords, so I will want to shape the phrase. For instance, I might start softer than the printed dynamic and gradually get louder and then get softer again. I'll want this shading to be as smooth and continuous as possible. On a real piano I would expect the soft notes to be a bit more mellow and gradually get brighter as I play louder and then get mellow again. My dynamic range is chosen by how soft and how brilliant I want that phrase to be. Usually it is in a pretty narrow range, but sometimes the range can be pretty dramatic.

Neither of these effects are possible on a digital piano because the notes don't gradually get mellower or brighter, there is a sudden jump when the velocity causes the mellower or brighter sample layer to kick in. Otherwise you can get louder and softer but the color of the notes doesn't change until it makes a sudden jump. So, the fine control needed for classical just isn't possible on a digital piano.

Actually, because of the sudden jump in multi-layered sounds I tend to prefer to use single layer voices and select the one that has the correct color for the material I am playing. In rock and pop this is usually more than sufficient.

Another issue related to tone production is the fact that digital pianos are much more forgiving about notes that are played so softly that they wouldn't sound on a real piano. Not only that, on the digital the volume can be turned up so that the dynamic level sounds like it is in the right range. Transfer this technique to a real piano and you are going to have all kinds of notes that didn't sound and the tone is going to be muddy and indistinct.

One last issue related to tone production is pedal control. I constantly use the damper pedal at all sorts of positions. Sometimes I just want to quickly and barely touch the strings with the dampers in order to thin the sound out without stopping it. Other times I want to partially lift the pedal in order to add a touch of "reverb" without losing the clarity and distinctness of the notes. On a digital it doesn't work the same. Not only that, you don't have to pedal like this because with 32 notes of polyphony you just hold the pedal down and the notes drop out fast enough to keep the sound from becoming a total wash. Again, good skills cannot be formed and bad habits are sure to become a problem.

Ryan

Top
#669902 - 08/26/04 12:50 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
Ryan, I read your post and disagree with some of your remarks. The action on my GranTouch really does respond exactly like a grand piano action (which it is). The sensors are optical and do not interfere with the action. The 'problems' I occasionally encounter on my GT are the same 'problems' I encounter on a real action. It responds in every way as a real action ... which it is.

You also keep mentioning 32 note polyphony as a limitation. In order for me to hear the limitation of that (in actual playing), I have to go out of my way to reach that limit and strain my ears to be sure if that low note really dropped out or not. Do you really encounter that 'limitation' in actual playing or is this just an argument you use against electric pianos (much like the 'limitation' of 128 velocity degrees).

I have thousands of hours logged in on my GranTouch and respectively disagree with you. (Also, this is not blind loyalty to a product or to a model, I wish Steinway would offer their action in such a hybrid. I have played hundreds of concerts in the US and a few here as well using acoustic pianos from nine footers to seven footers to the GranTouch. For me, my technique is not diminished at all from playing or practicing on an electric or, in my case, a hybrid piano. As an aside, I heard the Marriage of Figaro in Salzburg a few weeks ago and the 'harpsichord' was a Clavinova. Had I not seen the keyboard ahead of time, I never would have known. I don't think Mozart would have heard the difference as well.)

Also, you use the phrase 'tone production' where I would just use the word 'control'.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669903 - 08/26/04 01:25 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
ryan Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/04/01
Posts: 1995
Loc: Colorado
Hi Dave,

Again, you have totally missed my point. You may want to read up on how sample based engines are implemented and then reread my posts. Otherwise it is pointless to continue the discussion. I mean, for example the low note doesn't drop out when the 32 note limit is reached. Yamaha digital pianos use an algorithm that drops out inner voices in favor of the low notes.

I guess we will have to leave it as agreeing to disagree. Just so you know, my opinions were formed having spent hundreds and hundreds of hours on digital pianos. I've logged a lot of hours on the Gran Touch. And I stand by my statements. It would be pointless for me to practice my classical repertoire on a digital piano because the results simply would not translate.

Ryan

Top
#669904 - 08/26/04 02:03 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
Ryan, you're probably correct re the bass notes having priority (32 note polyphony) in favor of higher up notes. I had forgotten that.

Do you really encounter the situation where 32 note polyphony is not enough? If there are notes dropping out (32 note limit on my GT1) while I'm playing, I am note aware of it. It's more likely that I am not approaching the 32 note limit.

Re your comment about levels jumping when a new sample layer kicks in - I do not hear anything other than the sound getting slightly louder when I keep playing the same note with slightly more force. I do not hear the various sample layers kicking in.

Had I not known that there were three sample layers on my GT1, I never would have known they existed. Your ears and your level of playing must be on a much higher level than mine.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669905 - 08/26/04 06:07 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
ryan Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/04/01
Posts: 1995
Loc: Colorado
Yeah, I really did encounter situations where notes were dropping out. I heard it as a thinning of the sound and it taught me to not clean the pedal as much as I should. When I played a grand piano I would have rework my pedalling because the sound would build up into this uncontrollable mess! I was playing the Chopin Etudes and a set of Rachmaninoff Preludes at the time. I also started to get lazy and use a finger technique because I could, and my tone production really suffered due to the lack of fine control over color and dynamic. That was *my* experience and I am very glad to hear that yours has been much more positive!

I admit, my ears are picky - probably too picky these days. I am always listening for keyboards that sound fakey when I suspect the population at large has gotten used to and accepted the sound of sampled pianos. My reaction is always "ew! They used a sampled piano!" \:\)

Ryan

Top
#669906 - 08/26/04 11:19 AM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Pianocchio Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 21
Loc: Goodyear, AZ
I apologize for hijacking your thread here, but I was just wondering how much the GranTouch costs.

I've got a Keyboard right now, but it isn't very good, it isn't nearly sensitive enough to touch, the volume when a key is struck isn't predictable (i.e. I can hit a key softly for almost no sound and I can slam it and sometimes get almost no sound still.) Plus it doesn't have any pedals.

Anyway, I was wondering how much the GT20 normally goes for, I couldn't find any price on Yamaha's page

Top
#669907 - 08/26/04 12:11 PM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
Yamaha stopped marketing the GranTouch in the US. If you go to Yamaha's web site you'll see other models (more expensive and souped up versions) along with the basic GranTouch and those models are sold in the US. If you can get your hands on a GranTouch 1 or 2, you should pay about $6,000 or so. Don't quote me on this, but that's the ballpark figure.

The souped models which are GranTouch pianos but with more features than you might wish are a bit pricey and it would be worth your while to find a dealer who still has a GT in stock. Perhaps Yamaha itself can help you. I hope this has been some help.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669908 - 08/26/04 12:19 PM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Dave Horne Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/04
Posts: 5282
Loc: Vught, The Netherlands
The ballpark price I gave was for the GT1. Try Google's Froogle for prices ...

http://froogle.google.com/

The GT20 goes for $4250.
_________________________
website

mp3\wav files

AvantGrand N3, CP5

Top
#669909 - 08/26/04 09:40 PM Re: is an electric keyboard the way to go?
Pianocchio Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 21
Loc: Goodyear, AZ
Very cool, thanks a lot Dave. It is a little pricey(for now), I've found some nice upright acoustic pianos that are cheaper, but I don't know much about the upkeep of an acoustic, I've read a bit and it sounds pretty intense.


Anyway, thank you again.

Top

Moderator:  Piano World 
What's Hot!!
Christmas Header
- > Gift Ideas for Music Lovers < -
From PianoSupplies.com a division of Piano World.
-------------------
The December Free Piano Newsletter
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Interesting books about the piano, pianists, piano history, biographies, memoirs and more!
(ad) Yamaha CP Music Rest Promo
Yamaha CP Music Rest Promo
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Knabe Pianos
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
(ad) Piano Music Sale - Dover Publications
Piano Music Sale
Sheet Music Plus (125)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Kenny Barron and Dave Holland
by jjo
12/18/14 10:13 AM
Coming around the backstretch...
by RonTuner
12/18/14 09:11 AM
A new clip of Don Pullen in action
by rintincop
12/17/14 11:03 PM
Learn a Song in 7 minutes: Carol of the Bells
by Hugh Sung
12/17/14 10:11 PM
December 2014 Holiday Piano Bar
by piano_primo_1
12/17/14 06:14 PM
Forum Stats
77340 Members
42 Forums
159949 Topics
2349032 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
Gift Ideas for Music Lovers!
Find the Perfect Gift for the Music Lovers on your List!
Visit our online store today.

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission