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#684968 - 09/21/04 10:29 PM Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
oo Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/21/04
Posts: 4
Loc: Florida
I am a grad student. I played keyboard for 4 years when I was young and now I wanna start again, but with a piano. My budget is up to $1000. What I care most for a digital piano is the realistic touch, sound is second. And it doens't matter to me whether it's a stage piano or home piano, as long as I get the quality I want.

I cannot decide which one to get, P60, P90 or YDP113. I prefer P90's 64-note polyphony to the other two after reading a few comments here, though I still doubt for a beginner like me, whether I need all that polyphony. As for the touch, I ran into some reviews saying that the touch of YDP series are better than the P-series. Does anyone have any experience whether that's true or not?

Thanks for helping me out!

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#684969 - 09/22/04 02:21 AM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
pqdtw Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/06/04
Posts: 135
Loc: Netherlands
oops. sorry. didn't mean to post here...

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#684970 - 09/22/04 06:37 AM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
mark2048 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/31/04
Posts: 48
The action on the p90 is highly acclaimed on this board and others. I have never heard anything about the ydp113, but my guess is that the action is the same. The repairman who fixed a minor problem with my p250 said that the actions are all the same. Yamaha calls it "GH (Graded Hammer Effect) Weighted Action", which all the current p series and ydp series have. Yamaha makes somehthing called GH3 which you find in some of the high-end clavinovas.

With the ydp113 you are paying extra money for the fake wood cabinet, but you get more powerful speakers (20 Watt) than the p60 (8 Watt) or the p90 (no built-in speakers), and you don't have to buy a stand. The p120 has built in speakers, but probably not as good as the ydp113. Also, the ydp113 comes with a good pedal, as does the p90 (I think); the p60 comes with a cheap plastic one.

How important is the sound of the built-in speakers to you? Will you mostly be using headphones? Would you mind having extra cables and boxes lying around for a set of external powered speakes?

Most likely you won't need 64 polyphony, but the p60 manual say "32 max" polyphony which may mean that the stereo grand piano is only 16.

 Quote:
Originally posted by oo:
I am a grad student. I played keyboard for 4 years when I was young and now I wanna start again, but with a piano. My budget is up to $1000. What I care most for a digital piano is the realistic touch, sound is second. And it doens't matter to me whether it's a stage piano or home piano, as long as I get the quality I want.

I cannot decide which one to get, P60, P90 or YDP113. I prefer P90's 64-note polyphony to the other two after reading a few comments here, though I still doubt for a beginner like me, whether I need all that polyphony. As for the touch, I ran into some reviews saying that the touch of YDP series are better than the P-series. Does anyone have any experience whether that's true or not?

Thanks for helping me out! [/b]

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#684971 - 09/22/04 12:35 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
Lightnin Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/17/04
Posts: 210
 Quote:
Originally posted by oo:
I cannot decide which one to get, P60, P90 or YDP113. [/b]
You really should download the user manuals for these, and then compare them slowly and carefully, line for line, for features. Download at www.yamaha.com, Service/Support menu, then Manual Library at left, then search for P60, P90, etc.

The YDP113 compares to the P60, and the YDP223 compares to the P90/P120. Larger amplifier/speakers and wood cabinet are the big differences in these YDP (P90 has none). You probably do want larger speakers, which can be added to any.

The P60 has half-pedaling, but comes with a simple on/off pedal (not half pedaling). You have to provide the better pedal for the P60. The P90 has the good pedal already.

The P60 does not have a sound recorder at all, to record what you play. You probably already know what your playing sounds like, but it is a nice feature. Or you could record via MIDI on a PC.

The P90/P120 does record, however that recorded song will not go to the MIDI output port, you can only listen to it playback. If you want a permanent recorded copy, you still have to use MIDI to PC software to record it as you play it. Or playback via the headphone audio jack to an analog tape.

The P90/P120 has the more direct option buttons and switches, more obvious to use than the encrypted keyboard (P60 essentially has no buttons/switches, see the manual). I guess you would get used to the P60. Probably we usually just turn it on and play anyway.

The biggy is that the P90/P120 has dynamic piano sampling, soft, medium, loud samples per note, instead of one sampled level on the P60. This does change the sound, go listen to one. But review the manuals first.

Also the 64 polyphony instead of 32. This is stereo, two needed per note, and this is considered important if you use the pedal to sustain chords.

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#684972 - 09/22/04 01:36 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8483
Loc: Ohio, USA
do not get P60 if you intend to use it for extensive playing, because 32 polyphony is its limitation. i would probably choose P90/120 with only $1000. YDP223 would cost more than that.

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#684973 - 09/22/04 08:57 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
oo Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/21/04
Posts: 4
Loc: Florida
This forum is great! Thank you guys for the quick response. I do prefer to have build-in speakers. Now I am thinking of getting P90/P120 although P120 is a little over my budget. I found on the musiciansfriend.com, there is blemish P120 on sale for less than 1000, but they won't tell you how bad the dent or scratch is. ( I wouldn't mind some scratch, but having dents probably means that the piano had been dropped which I don't like.) So I wonder if anyone had experience buying stuff like that on their website.

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#684974 - 09/22/04 10:05 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
80k Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/14/04
Posts: 126
Loc: Portland, OR
eh, i don't know if i'd get a Blemished one. They are generally returned merchandise, and you don't know what the other person did with it.

One of the keys on the P90 lifted after only a month of playing and i ended up exchanging it for a P120.

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#684975 - 09/23/04 01:35 AM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
gryphon Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/09/01
Posts: 11678
Loc: Okemos, MI
Get the P90, not the P60. If you have to have speakers (rather than headphones) get the Yamaha YST-MS50B for $80. A thousand times better and a heck of a lot cheaper than paying $200 more the the P120.
_________________________
"If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
MSU - the university of Michigan!
Wheels

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#684976 - 09/23/04 10:20 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
BillH Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 9
Do you hook up the YST-MS50 speakers to the Phone jacks or to the stereo jacks (or does it make any difference)? I'm trying to understand the difference.

I was thinking about getting the P120 and getting the extra speakers for $80 based on your suggestion. 1000 times better, huh? 20W per speaker seems like alot of power. Is it suitable even if I only play in a 10' by 12' room?

Thanks for any thoughts on this.

--BillH

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#684977 - 09/24/04 06:51 AM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
Lightnin Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/17/04
Posts: 210
It just depends on your speakers connector type, connect them where the cables fit. My YST-MS50 speakers have a stereo cable (as opposed to a Left and a Right cable), so I connect them to the P90 headphone jack. These MS50 speakers have a new headphone jack which silences the speakers.

The P120 internal speakers are acceptable, and portable, but are too small to have much bass response, and pianos go quite low in frequency. The larger external speakers just sound better, mainly at the low end. Exaggerating but think table radio versus larger stereo. Both sound like piano, but the larger one sounds better. Compare their sound in a retail instrument store that displays the keyboards.. the display units will surely be connected to external speakers, so just unplug speakers to compare with and without.

This is why the YDP models primarily differ by having larger and more powerful speakers. Their wood cabinet furniture allows this space, and portability is not an issue.

20 watts is not an issue for a small room.. you have a volume control.

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#684978 - 09/24/04 04:24 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
freda_bloogs Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/24/04
Posts: 2
Loc: UK
May I add on a note that the CLP-115 is the same as the YDP-113 sans the sostenuto and soft pedals.
_________________________
Daley - Piano, Guitar, Bass, Drums and Vocal Cords

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#684979 - 09/25/04 10:57 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
lesecret Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 39
I've seen a couple of websites selling the P-120 at about $1100. Most websites offer it at about $1200, but a couple of these will beat whatever lower price you find. So you can go to these sites and let them know that you found sites offering it at $1100. I've got offers at $1085 and $1086 this way.

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#684980 - 09/27/04 08:39 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
oo Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/21/04
Posts: 4
Loc: Florida
Thanks for the info, my friends! I went to the local music store and tried out some models today, mostly Roland ( since I couldn't find the local yamaha store. ) I like the sound of RD-170, although the touch may be a little bit too light for me even at the heavy setting, (too light for my right hand, just all right for the left since I used to play keyboard ) and so do all other Roland models. I notice that there has been a big price drop for RD-170 from ~$1200 to $900, which puts it in the same price range as P90. Haven't seen you guys talking about the RD-170 model a lot. How's it compared to the P90? Are Roland keyboards lighter than the average acoustic piano?

Thanks again!

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#684981 - 09/27/04 08:57 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8483
Loc: Ohio, USA
 Quote:
Are Roland keyboards lighter than the average acoustic piano?
i guess that's what most people would tell you. i like Yamaha key action better, heavier and more realistic like acoustic piano's.

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#684982 - 09/27/04 09:40 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
80k Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/14/04
Posts: 126
Loc: Portland, OR
Roland keys really do not feel weighted at all, after playing Yamaha for awhile. I assume I could get used to the Roland's, but my experiences with them at the store found the action to be unacceptable. Perhaps I would feel the opposite, if i'd gotten used to Roland though. Bottom line, you need to try both!

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#684983 - 09/27/04 09:46 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
SteveY Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/06/01
Posts: 1820
Loc: NJ
I think it's important to realize that not all Roland actions are the same (neither are Yamaha's). There's a lot of generalization on this board about Yamaha or Roland actions. For example, the RD170 is nothing like the top of the line Roland actions.
_________________________
PianoWorld disclaimer: musician, producer, arranger, author, clinician, consultant, PS2 aficionado, secret agent...

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#684984 - 09/27/04 10:12 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
oo Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/21/04
Posts: 4
Loc: Florida
I guess I'm back to yamaha then. Gotta find that local dealer tomorrow! Must be a small store in the corner.

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#684985 - 09/27/04 10:22 PM Re: Hesitating: P60, P90 or YDP113?
Kenpcola Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/07/04
Posts: 86
Loc: Pensacola, FL
I don't think YDP 223 compare to P120 at all.
Try for yourself. Actions are way different. YDP has action is closer to real grand to me. With 120, you will need stand, a set of pedals(3 pedals but not sure it supports all three), amplification and better speakers(as above), piano stool,.. they add up.
With 223 you will have all these included.

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