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#1376167 - 02/17/10 02:07 AM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: megrenk]
Kawai James Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8370
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Ah, I see.
Well, I was just trying to give Roland the benefit of the doubt.

Incidentally, while visiting one of the music chain stores in this country, I made a point of asking the salesperson if there had been any such problems reported with the Roland 'Ivory Feel' key surfaces. She maintained that there had not been any issues.

Ah, by the way, I shall assume you meant December 2008, not 2009, for the initial date of purchase, yes?

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#1377095 - 02/18/10 05:19 AM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: megrenk]
megrenk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/18/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
grin

B and E keys... B major scale over two octaves in parallel motion is what I practiced at the time I go the new keyboard assembly... otherwise I would have a more evenly distributed key "wear".


And yes Dec 08, sorry...


Edited by megrenk (02/18/10 05:22 AM)
_________________________
"Happiness is a matter of traveling, not a destination to arrive at!"

Music makes me happy: www.max.grenkowitz.net/

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#1377101 - 02/18/10 05:29 AM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: megrenk]
megrenk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/18/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
In many instances store sales people do not know about the issues when customers approach the manufacturer directly... in my case the sales person knew, but moved shortly after to another town; other local sales people may not have known or been aware of this issue.

But hen talking sales: you wanna sell the things and not bag 'em smile

And speaking of brands: I had a Kawai before, that had an issue nobody claimed to know about... got it replaced with the next model were it was claimed the problem is not known ... yet which showed the same 'firmware' related problem.

Maybe it is the customer's fault smile
_________________________
"Happiness is a matter of traveling, not a destination to arrive at!"

Music makes me happy: www.max.grenkowitz.net/

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#1377206 - 02/18/10 09:35 AM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: megrenk]
JcSr56 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/09/09
Posts: 58
Loc: Va
Being a keyboard player of only 14-15 months; I am unable to make any comparisons to other key tops materials. I bought my RD700gx in Oct.09, and I play about 15-20 hours a week.

Mine is experiencing the same wear as others, and I too, don't think it has anything to do with when the board was manufactured. I think it is the material that is used.

They actually make the claim that the keys will not be slippery due to sweating(or something like that), and it's because it is a pourous material, and therefor is very soft. Herein lies the problem.

I love the instrument, and am extremely happy with it, but what I hate about the potential servicing issue is that the gx is a stage piano, and only comes with a 1 year warranty, as opposed to the home units that are, I think, 3-5 years. Even though I use mine just for studio use, and not for road use(which I understand the shortened warranty due to handling damage), they should still cover this pre-mature key tops wear.

I'm getting a bit aggravated with Roland, as I also bought a Juno-G before buying the gx, and many folks are having LCD failure issues with them.

John
_________________________
guitar player for 48 years, and started playing the piano 16 months ago.

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#1377495 - 02/18/10 04:44 PM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: JcSr56]
eJohn Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/27/07
Posts: 129
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Interesting. I've been waiting since Apr 2009 for Roland to send a replacement keyboard for my HP-207, and so far, parts are still on "back order". From what megrenk and others here are saying, my replacement - if it ever comes - may be no better than what I have now. On the other hand, some people claim they've experienced no wear problems at all.

So what's going on? Are there good and bad versions of the "ivory feel" keys out there (if so, why would Roland replace bad ones with other bad ones?), or are they all the same? And what about the new HP-307?

Still have to say, my key-wear is not severe, only a minor annoyance. And Roland still has by far better action and sound than on other digital (or most acoustic upright) pianos I've played, IMHO. So if worse comes to worse, I can easily live with it.

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#1377541 - 02/18/10 05:49 PM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: eJohn]
IanMac Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/10/10
Posts: 1
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Maybe it has something to do with a person's body chemistry...or, to put it less delicately, the composition of their sweat.

It may be that some individuals have more of a certain chemical in their perspiration which is reacting with the material in the keys.

Higher end Yamaha pianos use Ivoryite, a sedimentary precipitate of magnesium, calcium and silica. which is slightly harder than ivory. As far as I know, there has been no problems with perspiration.

Roland is apparently making their own ivory substitute; I'm not sure if it is related to Ivoryite, and no doubt it's composition is a trade secret.

Some people can't wear metal backed watches or certain types of jewelry or even leather/synthetic leather straps because their perspiration reacts with the material.

Just another suggestion (more of a guess).

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Canada clinician/demonstrator; Portable Keyboard Division

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#1377575 - 02/18/10 06:49 PM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: IanMac]
Kawai James Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8370
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
IanMac, yes, that's a very good point.

Welcome to the forum by the way!

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#1377929 - 02/19/10 06:47 AM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: Kawai James]
megrenk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/18/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
Yes, it is a good question...
I don't sweat at all while playing.
Maybe I am not practicing hard enough smile
I suspected my thumb's fingernails, but they are cut back, too much for my liking and do not hit the keys...
Yet looking at the B major white keys, these are hit by the thumb.
Go figure.

BYW: I always wash my hands prior to playing; they are completely rubbed dry before touching the keys.

I thought a lot about this issue... it doesn't make sense to me.

My current stance: I love the sound of the HP207; will wait for the keys to become worn, and get them replaced before the warranty expires... and put it under "Sh!t happens".
_________________________
"Happiness is a matter of traveling, not a destination to arrive at!"

Music makes me happy: www.max.grenkowitz.net/

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#1377999 - 02/19/10 09:52 AM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: megrenk]
JcSr56 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/09/09
Posts: 58
Loc: Va
Even though the article/advertisement that I read, mentioned the sweat issue; I don't think that's the trouble. I think it's the fingernails.

I haven't taken HD close up pictures of mine, but it appears as very light scratches that are digging into the material. Mine is also just a minor cosmetic issue now, but with time it's obviously going to get worse. I can see the potential for grooves to form as the material wears away.

I love the feel of the keys; I just wish they could find a way to stop the deterioration. I'm aware that a number of folks feel that the average life of a DP is around 5 years, but I planned on using this thing for a lifetime(I'm 57 now).

I hope Roland will step up in some shape or form, and publicly address the issue.

John
_________________________
guitar player for 48 years, and started playing the piano 16 months ago.

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#1378835 - 02/20/10 01:02 PM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: megrenk]
Muppet Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/01/09
Posts: 2
My HP-207's keyboard was replaced about two months ago under warranty due to the premature keyboard wear issue... The original keyboard assembly had a PCB that was marked as being made in China. The replacement assembly had a PCB that was marked as being made in Japan.

That being said, the wear issue still seems to be unresolved. I'm noticing a little wear on one of the keys, following the same pattern as the previous keyboard assembly. I'll watch to see if the wear gets worse. If so, Roland is going to have a problem with all their products that use the same kind of simulated ivory finish, including their new HP-307s, etc.

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#1378986 - 02/20/10 04:46 PM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: Muppet]
eJohn Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/27/07
Posts: 129
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Thanks for the information Muppet and the rest of you who are experiencing this problem, and please continue to post updates. I'm referring my local Roland service center to this website to follow this thread.

Another question: Has anyone considered asking Roland to replace their ivory-feel surface with a traditional plastic one (like that on the HP-203)? Is a stable plastic surface better than a worn/rough ivory surface that degrades over time?

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#1380132 - 02/22/10 04:30 AM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: eJohn]
megrenk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/18/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
Hmm, sounds like an idea eJohn...
... but isn't this like getting a 2-litre replacement engine in a 4-litre chevvy?
smile
_________________________
"Happiness is a matter of traveling, not a destination to arrive at!"

Music makes me happy: www.max.grenkowitz.net/

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#1401080 - 03/22/10 02:37 AM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: megrenk]
Sia_Mac Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/19/09
Posts: 3
Loc: ON,Canada
Hey everyone
I gor my 207 on April 09. After a few months, signs of this so called dandruff started to appear. I first taught it's common. but after googling it, if found out it's not! I then asked the local dealer about it and they had the whole key top replaced in last January. It's been like 2 months and it has started to appear again.I always have very short nails and never sweat while playing. So there should be something wrong with the keys. I think:
1- Firstly, whoever wants to buy these ivory keys SHOULD really consider it.
2- Roland should officially and publicly admit this. I'll wait for a few months and if it keeps wearing off, I'll try to follow it seriously, cause it's an expensive piano and in this price range, the company SHOULD be more careful about it's QA section.

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#1666497 - 04/25/11 07:12 PM Re: Roland HP207: Are your keytops having dandruff? [Re: Sia_Mac]
JHbackingtracks Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 64
I'm having the EXACT same problem with the NX!!! (The latest one)

They've just solved this issue with the note stealing, and now this crops up! Just after I was all happy deciding to keep it as well.

I can see it starting to happen on C and G, and I've only been playing it seriously for about 3/4 weeks now. It's starting to look like 'scratches' rather than wear, but I can see how the wear might begin

I have a 5 year warranty, I wonder if this would be covered, so when it gets to the stage where I really can't use it, or don't want to touch the keys I could just get a new board! But I don't want to have to be doing that every so often, too much hassle.
_________________________
J.T.Harrison

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