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#695193 - 02/04/05 03:33 PM the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
rouche Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/05
Posts: 9
Loc: Bologna, Italy
I tried a Casio px100 today and for a novice like myself, i was particularly smitten, especially by its price of 520 euros. The only thing it lacks is a drawbar organ sound of b3 preportions. I have no aspirations other than playing at home and getting some professor longhair and jimmy smith tunes down pat. the opportunity to connect the keyboard via midi to my mac may solve the loss of a decent organ sound and i found the piano and electric piano quite adequate for my level which is still a beginner.
can anyone give me some advice on a better solution within the same price (already 520 euros is the top of my budget). i couldn't care less for any bells and drums and what-nots. just a good piano sound, a good electric keyboard sound, and a good organ sound.
thanks

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#695194 - 02/04/05 08:00 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
dbm Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/24/04
Posts: 166
At the price range with hammer action this keyboard is hard to beat. There are non-weighted Yamaha digital pianos with more voices and (in my opnion) better sound but if serious piano playing is the plan a weighted keyboard is the only choice. Also hammer action is better than simple weighted action in that the finger pressure sets an internal weight flying. A noticible difference (versus simple weight) is that there is additinal resistance when keys are pressed down fast due to energy being stored as kinetic energy in the "hammer".

Now some additonal personal observations:

Some of the PX series displays I tried were light and responsive. Some were heavier and sluggish. I can't explain the inconsistencies among the same model. Also, it appears to me that the pivoting point of the keys are fairly close to the root of the keys. I feel the key dip at the root of the keys quite shallow and the pressure needed increases a lot compared to the tip of the keys. Compare to other brands in this "root" area and you may better understand what I am talking about. I also feel that the keys are a bit shorter than other makes but it could be illusionary.

Don't be alarmed if the onboard speaker sound doesn't impress, take a set of headphones and you'll find that the sound quality is quite good.

I personally like Yamaha P60 and certain Roland models better but they are 1.5 times more expensive.

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#695195 - 02/05/05 05:43 AM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
rouche Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/05
Posts: 9
Loc: Bologna, Italy
I'll try the P60 and Roland equivalent today but i fear they may be beyond my budget. even the px300 might be pushing it a little too.
I tried the Nord B3 type organ - way out of my price range - but my, was it satisfying. of course the issue of weighted keys does not apply. but the sound quality was excellent.
Ideally I'm searching for something similar to the px100 but with an adequate b3 organ sound.
I have an old single keyboard Korg CX3 at home in england which one day i hope to bring to italy. lacking the second keyboard for left hand work meant that the right hand lost its punch. a new keyboard used primarily as a piano/electric piano and as a left hand organ is essentially what i'm looking for.

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#695196 - 02/05/05 09:47 AM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
rouche Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/05
Posts: 9
Loc: Bologna, Italy
How does the sound of the px 300 match up with the px100 or the px400?

I tried the P60 and preferred the px-100. however, i have just discovered that on the px100 there is no output to connect to an amplifier. What function would a stage piano have without a jack out? This puts the px100 out of the running.
I just read the pdf manual of the px300 which not only has a jack out and in, but also includes a jazz organ sound.
i tried a px400 in the store today and felt that the sound didn't match up to the px100. unfortunately there wasn't a px300 to try. can anyone give me a verdict on the sound quality of the grand piano / electric piano / and Jazz organ?
One last question: as to connecting the keyboard to a computer, what's the cheapest way?

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#695197 - 02/05/05 01:33 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
Neophyte Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/20/04
Posts: 25
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Before I ordered my PX-100 I did quite a few searches thru the archives of this forum and other piano sites. There was quite a bit of discussion on the lack of an output jack on the PX-100 but it was noted that the headphone jack was low output enough that it could be used thru an amplifier.
As for the sound, I take my lessons on a PX-300 and I cannot tell the difference in the piano sounds between the 300 and 100. The 300 does have many more available sounds, but I went with the 100 because I'm only interested in piano in any case.

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#695198 - 02/05/05 02:16 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
rouche Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/05
Posts: 9
Loc: Bologna, Italy
Thanks for the confirmation on the piano sounds between the 100 and the 300. It would almost persuade me to stick with the 100 if not for the advantage of the Line-In Jack which would allow the possibility to play along with recorded pieces from a cd player. Practising with headphones makes this asset a must. Unless, of course, there's another way to jack in recorded music that i'm unaware of.
Unfortunately, my budget may persuade me to stick with the px100 unless someone can offer any advice on good European dealers who can offer a better price on the px300. my local retailer sells it for 690 euros.

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#695199 - 02/07/05 01:08 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
me_dup1 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/19/02
Posts: 261
Loc: north of 53
 Quote:
Originally posted by rouche:
the advantage of the Line-In Jack which would allow the possibility to play along with recorded pieces from a cd player[/b]
Can also use a mixer.

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#695200 - 02/07/05 02:49 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
rouche Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/05
Posts: 9
Loc: Bologna, Italy
After all things considered and the good advice of you all, I'm going for the px100. If ever it comes a time to play it amplified, i'll put it through the headphone jack. if i really need to play along with a cd i can fork out the money for a mixer or simply connect it to my computer via a usb midi interface (the cheapest i found is the m-audio uno for 50 euros - if another exists with all the cables let us know). that way i can also benefit from the superior hammond b3 reproduction of garageband. frankly, the organ sound of the px400 just isn't anywhere near good enough.
with the px100 i get everything i need: a good piano and electric piano. what more could i ask for?
if they could include a stand, i'd be a happy man. somehow i doubt it.

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#695201 - 02/07/05 04:18 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
SteveY Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/06/01
Posts: 1820
Loc: NJ
As far as B3 sounds, you might want to try the B4 from Native Instruments. It's very economical and sounds wonderful!!! I use it all the time!
_________________________
PianoWorld disclaimer: musician, producer, arranger, author, clinician, consultant, PS2 aficionado, secret agent...

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#695202 - 02/08/05 08:47 AM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
Seaside_Lee Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/19/04
Posts: 2160
Loc: Blackpool, UK
Just jumping in on this topic

If I wanted to ever use my PX100 as a stage piano? rather than go through the headphone outs is it possible to go from the midi out into a kind of midi box of tricks and then from there on to an amplifier or mixer?


Or am I just better trading it in for a p120?


Lee \:\)
_________________________
My Piano Journey Blog...Seaside Lee's Piano Journey...
New Piano Video...Learn To Play "I Dreamed A Dream" with Seaside

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#695203 - 02/08/05 09:45 AM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
cobs Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/16/04
Posts: 327
Loc: London
Well that would wprk fine, but you'd need to buy a very expensive tone generator for a decent piano sound (which would cost about the same as P120), and then you might still prefer the action on the P120, which you'll be lacking.

Or you could use a laptop with a soft synth piano sound such as Gigapiano.
_________________________
A proud employee of Yamaha-Kemble Music

(please scan all posts with bias scanner...)

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#695204 - 02/09/05 07:14 AM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
Seaside_Lee Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/19/04
Posts: 2160
Loc: Blackpool, UK
Thanks cobs

Okay I think I'll just trade it in ;\) ...another 12 months or so and maybe I just may be ready to try to play for $$$$'s (I'll trade it then )


Lee \:\)
_________________________
My Piano Journey Blog...Seaside Lee's Piano Journey...
New Piano Video...Learn To Play "I Dreamed A Dream" with Seaside

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#695205 - 02/09/05 03:41 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
Neophyte Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/20/04
Posts: 25
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Now you're thinking like me. If I ever get good enough that I need a better piano to play on stage, the PX-100 I just bought will have been worth every single penny I paid and more. The trade-in credit would be a bonus.

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#695206 - 02/10/05 02:44 AM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
Seaside_Lee Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/19/04
Posts: 2160
Loc: Blackpool, UK
Hi Neophyte

To be honest I wasn't thinking like you \:\( ...I was annoyed with myself that I had rushed in and bought the PX100 instead of waiting a few months and getting the P120.

But, you have cheered me up today...I like the way you are thinking \:\) ...and I am going to think of it in exactly the same way from now on


best regards


Lee \:D
_________________________
My Piano Journey Blog...Seaside Lee's Piano Journey...
New Piano Video...Learn To Play "I Dreamed A Dream" with Seaside

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#695207 - 02/10/05 03:17 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
rouche Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/05
Posts: 9
Loc: Bologna, Italy
the p60 vs the px100
I had almost convinced myself to buy the px100 when at the last minute i had a quick go on the p60. as much as i tried to ignore it the piano sound was superior but more importanly the action made you want to play. i found myself inventing phrases on the p60 yet when i moved over to the px100 and replayed them it just didn't sound the same nor did i feel as inspired.
yes, the cash is a problem, but it doesn't stop there. the onboard speakers are much louder than the casio. and on a simply aesthetic point the yamaha p60 is the bees knees.
unfortunately, the electric piano sound on the yamaha is quite poor whereas the casio has a good heavy funky electric piano, the type favoured by jazz and soul players, unlike that favoured by holiday resort musicians.
am i mistaken?
I read that the p80 had a host of good sounds including different pianos and jazz organs. unfortunately i haven't tried one out. can anyone confirm the sound quality of the p80 and whether it was transferred to the p120. the jazz organ on the 120 sounded good but the rest were pretty synthetic i found.

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#695208 - 02/10/05 03:25 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
JazzP120 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/12/04
Posts: 136
The P-120 is superior to the P-80, sound and feel wise.

The P-120 uses the newer GH2 action, which has superb feel and response. The P-120 also uses superior Acoustic Piano sound technology.

P-80: 4mb Triple Strike Acoustic Pianos
P-120: 22mb Triple Strike Acoustic Pianos

Chris

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#695209 - 02/10/05 07:37 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
scotward57 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 22
Loc: Boise ID
The P120 is superior to all of the digital pianos mentioned above and it just saddens me that anyone would waste time and money on a piece of junk like the Casio Privia series or skimp and get a cheaper Yamaha like the P60.

When I was younger and has less money, I always rationalized buying cheap. I would say things like "Ah...I can't afford the one I really want so I'll buy this instead". And I'd go buy the piece of junk and wonder why I was unhappy with it within a couple of months.

If a portable digital piano is a must, buy the P120 and don't let anyone else talk you into anything else.

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#695210 - 02/10/05 07:54 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
ProPianoGuyBC Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/24/04
Posts: 388
I will take this opportunity to suggest that you have a close look at the new Roland RD300SX. There is a difference in sound and touch between Roland and Yamaha (and all others for that matter) You won't ever know if the piano you are looking at is right until you literally try EVERYTHING that is available!

Sorry guys but the P-120 is NOT the be all end all of portable digital pianos! Different strokes for different folks granted, but this forum is about educating the masses as to the wondrous variety of different keyed instruments there are on the market today! So to say the P-120 is the best for everyone is narrowminded and just plain NOT true!

I have all the respect in the world for the fact that you guys love your P-120's, but try to temper your enthusiasm!

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#695211 - 02/11/05 03:52 AM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
Seaside_Lee Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/19/04
Posts: 2160
Loc: Blackpool, UK
Yeah I know Scotsward :rolleyes:


Don't rub it in \:\( ...just when I'd cheered myself up about my PX100 aswell

I will trade it in...okay?...sheesh ;\)

The reason the PX100 seemed so good to me at the time I bought it was I had been learning to play on a usb midi controller and the weighted action of the PX100 seemed fantastic...and I didn't know there was a forum that discussed digital pianos back then

Still its allright for practising on ;\)


Lee
_________________________
My Piano Journey Blog...Seaside Lee's Piano Journey...
New Piano Video...Learn To Play "I Dreamed A Dream" with Seaside

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#695212 - 02/11/05 07:14 AM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
markb Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 2593
Loc: Maryland
I've had my PX300 for about two weeks and really enjoy it. It suits my needs and budget.

It's my firm belief that the skill of the musician, much more than the alleged quality of an instrument, is what makes an instrument sound good (or bad). When I played drums, I bought a Tama Swingstar set. This was Tama's entry-level line. It wasn't promoted as being a professional line, but I was a student and had to keep costs down. I initially had a generic, no-name ride cymbal and hi-hat cymbals and later added a couple of low-end Paiste cymbals. That setup served me well through years of lessons and several bands. I never heard any complaints from band members, audience members, or my teacher, about the drums or how I could have sounded better with a "better" and more expensive set. In fact, I actually got compliments on my cheapo ride cymbal and the cheapest Paiste crash cymbal I used.

I had an aunt who was a concert pianist in Israel. I guess about 15 years ago, she was visiting here. I wasn't into piano then but had a Casio 3/4-sized key, no touch sensitivity, no-nothing toy. My aunt played the Minute Waltz on that piece of garbage, and while she missed some keys (for obvious reasons), that stupid Casio still sounded wonderful for that minute it was played by a skilled musician.

I'm not advocating that everyone should by the cheapest instrument they can. I also don't think it's right to deride other people's choice of instruments. I think people should buy what they can reasonably afford and what they enjoy playing. I just know that I'll never go into debt or take out a second mortgage on the house in order to buy an instrument so I can sound good. If I want to sound good, I'll have to practice.
_________________________
markb--The Count of Casio

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#695213 - 02/11/05 07:29 AM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
SteveY Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/06/01
Posts: 1820
Loc: NJ
 Quote:
It's my firm belief that the skill of the musician, much more than the alleged quality of an instrument, is what makes an instrument sound good (or bad).
I agree wholeheartedly.

The "rub" here on this forum is found when people's expectations exceed their budget. How many times have we read posts that say: "I want a totally realistic piano sample, superior feeling action, and it needs to be under 40lbs... Oh yeah, and it has to be less than $500..."? In those cases, it might be better for the person to wait until their budget catches up with their expectations.
_________________________
PianoWorld disclaimer: musician, producer, arranger, author, clinician, consultant, PS2 aficionado, secret agent...

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#695214 - 02/11/05 01:00 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
cobs Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/16/04
Posts: 327
Loc: London
 Quote:
Originally posted by JazzP120:
The P-120 is superior to the P-80, sound and feel wise.

The P-120 uses the newer GH2 action, which has superb feel and response.

Chris [/b]
P120 and P80 have exactly the same Graded Hammer Effect action.

Rouche, if its a question of P80 or P60, definitely go for the P80. It is far better in sound and build quality. (but no speakers, if thats important for you)
_________________________
A proud employee of Yamaha-Kemble Music

(please scan all posts with bias scanner...)

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#695215 - 02/11/05 01:02 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
cobs Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/16/04
Posts: 327
Loc: London
 Quote:
Originally posted by rouche:

unfortunately, the electric piano sound on the yamaha is quite poor whereas the casio has a good heavy funky electric piano, the type favoured by jazz and soul players, unlike that favoured by holiday resort musicians.
am i mistaken? [/b]
Alot of people prefer the electric piano sounds on Roland pianos, I suggest you try them?

But - Are you sure you tried both electric pianos on the P60? EP1 is the 80s-ballad type sound, EP2 is the funkier one (rhodes)
_________________________
A proud employee of Yamaha-Kemble Music

(please scan all posts with bias scanner...)

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#695216 - 02/11/05 01:08 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
cobs Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/16/04
Posts: 327
Loc: London
 Quote:
Originally posted by scotward57:
If a portable digital piano is a must, buy the P120 and don't let anyone else talk you into anything else. [/b]
And don't let anyone talk you into buying one piano, without leaving you with any option to make up your own mind...
_________________________
A proud employee of Yamaha-Kemble Music

(please scan all posts with bias scanner...)

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#695217 - 02/11/05 01:08 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
JazzP120 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/12/04
Posts: 136
 Quote:
Originally posted by cobs:
 Quote:
Originally posted by JazzP120:
The P-120 is superior to the P-80, sound and feel wise.

The P-120 uses the newer GH2 action, which has superb feel and response.

Chris [/b]
P120 and P80 have exactly the same Graded Hammer Effect action.

Rouche, if its a question of P80 or P60, definitely go for the P80. It is far better in sound and build quality. (but no speakers, if thats important for you) [/b]
No, they use different versions. A Yamaha employee has verified this.

P-80 uses GH, while P-120 uses GH2.

Chris

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#695218 - 02/11/05 01:11 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
cobs Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/16/04
Posts: 327
Loc: London
I'm suprised, I'll have to check that one out for myself.
_________________________
A proud employee of Yamaha-Kemble Music

(please scan all posts with bias scanner...)

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#695219 - 02/11/05 01:15 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
JazzP120 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/12/04
Posts: 136
Yes, they use a different mechanism.

Chris

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#695220 - 02/11/05 05:02 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
rouche Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/04/05
Posts: 9
Loc: Bologna, Italy
gentlemen,
thank you all for your advice. Unfortunately the p80 is out of the running since i can't get hold of one here in this part of Italy. as much as i am still fond of the px100 entry price and Rhodes sound, the p60 may have pipped it to the post. However, the p90 may now be in the running though quite unlikely as a serious contender considering my budget was once 200 euros (for a midi controller), increased to 520 euros for the px100, and once again bumped up to 690 for the p60. pushing it to 890 for the p90 seems a little out of the question. unless, of course, I consider renting.
if i have time tomorrow i will
a) inquire about renting equipment
b) try the Roland pianos
c) test all of the contenders through headphones.

the p120 certainly sounds like a serious piano for a serious player with serious money, hardly suitable for a beginner.
it's true that a good musician could make a pile of bricks sound musical. it's also true that a good instrument can inspire music and skill while a bad instrument may well hamper the growth of a musician.
from what i've read on this forum the px100 will satisfy a competent pianist and be of great value for a beginner. the p60 not only does this but also has an extended longevity in the development of a pianist. the p90 and the p120 may well be the be all and end all for many serious pianists. but for professional musicians, when the real thing isn't feasible, there are still many more rungs on the ladder of quality digital pianos, a domain perhaps more apt for personal ear and skill than consumer advice.

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#695221 - 02/11/05 08:41 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
Neophyte Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/20/04
Posts: 25
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Whatever you decide have fun and don't worry about buyer's remorse afterward.
I went thru this when I started playing guitar over a decade ago. Bought a cheap old used Hohner acoustic for 50 bucks to learn on at first. It was missing the bottom five frets and was pretty beat up. The shop owner referred to it as "The Campfire Special".
I regretted the purchase almost immediately but learned on it pretty well before buying a better guitar. Over the years I went thru dozens of guitars... electrics, acoustics, 12 strings, Martins, Gibsons, Larrivees... you name it.
Today I only have one guitar and it is The Campfire Special. For some reason I never sold it. As it turned out I never really got to be a very good guitarist and this one sounds about as good as any guitar is going to sound that is being played by me.
So after all the agonizing it turned out I had bought the right guitar on the first try all along.
To each his own... some people love the Yamaha or Roland models, some won't be happy with anything less than an acoustic. Me, I'm quite happy right now with my PX-100.

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#695222 - 02/11/05 08:43 PM Re: the casio px100/300: advice on a b3organ, grand piano and electric keyboard anyone?
Neophyte Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/20/04
Posts: 25
Loc: Ontario, Canada
BTW, I think the posts by the people who sliced up the quality of the digital pianos other than the ones they owned smack of downright pettiness. You can expouse the virtues of the instruments you like without making degrading comments about the instruments or playing abilities of others.
Real musicians have class.

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