I was examining digital pianos as several retailers and it struck me that the Yamaha YDP-121 looked very similar to the Yamaha CLP840 (a Clavinova).

Upon reviewing the spec sheets, I noticed that they were equally similar in structure, speaker wattage, and more. Are these two virtually identical save for their finish and (perhaps) the weighting methods of their keys? We couldn't really compare the sound quality since they were in different environments when we tested them. The YDP-121 sounded a bit boxy but we suspect that might have been because of the showroom.

We're looking into an inexpensive digital for our daughter and thought that either of these might be a good starter. Yes, we are aware that a good acoustic would be superior but this is the route we may have to take. We would appreciate any comments or reviews on either of these Yamahas or on any competing digitals in the $1500 price range.

Best Regards,

- Hans

I would take a pass on both these models since they only have 32 note polyphony which at the present is substandard.

Polyphony is the total number of notes that can be played simultaneously usually expressed as a power of 2. The higher the number, the better. 128 is the current benchmark; most are 64; 32 is substandard.

It would be discouraging when playing these two models to notice that notes are dropping out prematurely, especially when playing densely noted measures with the sustain pedal. The notes you played at the beginning of the measure would not be heard by the time you reach the end of the measure. This is usually due to insufficient computer memory or slow CPU speed (a digital piano is a computer attached to a keyboard). A digital piano's computer processor is not upgradeable.

Look for models that have 64 note polyphony as a minimum. 128 is better but more expensive.

Visit this web site: www.iaekm.org/p15.html for a list of all the digital piano manufacturers. Think twice about Alesis; the last I heard was that they had filed for bankruptcy.

Visit this web site for more digital piano information: www.ptg.org/rmmp/digital.FAQ.html

I hope this helps.

I agree with FR, I told you in the other forum stay away from Yamaha. It is just like McDonals, because they are popular it doesn't mean they make
good food.

Why avoid Yamaha?
They make some of the best digital pianos in the world.

I'm not saying all their digital pianos are great... but the higher end models are pretty sweet.

I agree their higher models, but our friend is looking into the low end stuff.

Hello Hans (Tikidude),

Here is a cut-and-paste of a review I did on my YDP-121 on 2/17/02. I still stand by it, and I might add this is the best $1099.00 I have ever spent. Don't settle for the Yamaha 80 (You need a stand and it doesn't have pedals), also, this is no "...Mc Donalds Value Meal...",

Note: Your daughter will not be outgrowing the polyphony feature on this piano until she is playing "Revolutionary" by F. Chopin (I will not be able to do this in my life time). I am assuming she is a beginner since you said you're looking for a starter.

P.S. there hasn't been a week that has passed that I didn't play my Piano (it is a piano). It's a pleasure to learn and play on. If I could afford a $10,000 - $20,000 acustic piano I would by one, but as a beginner I can not even begin to justify a purchase like this. And I would be unhappy with a $4,000 piano.

My son is three years old and he is alreay spending time at the piano bench.

----------- Cut and paste ------------------
Today I went to a piano outlet and I tried out their (all prices in retail) $8,000.00 accustic pianos (a Yamaha and some Korean brand), and I can honestly tell you that it is going to take a hell of lot more $$$ than a $8,000 acustic to get the sound and feel of $1099.00 YDP-121 Digital Piano ! This is no exageration.

The saleman was really nice and asked me if I wanted to play a Steinway, I said "oh no no, I'm just looking"(I'm not worthy :-) ), He said "come give it a try."

So he sat me down at a $28,000.00 Steinway upright -- oh my god, what a beautiful piano, and a wonderful sound and feel. Then he said "this Steinway over here is the one everyone who comes here want's to see and play" -- a $62,000.00 piano he said. My mouth ran dry from the excitement of sitting in front of this beautiful beautiful black piano. I'm not qualified to review this piano, but I really was humbled, I played a few notes (nice bass), thanked the salesman very much for his time and for showing me the Steinways.

Back to your original question, $1,099.00 (US)is the lowest price I've seen.

Another big plus of this purchase is the book of music you get. 50 titles by -- Bach, Mozart, Chopin, Debussy, etc. All these are contained in the playback memory of the YDP-121. The music book even shows you the recommended fingerings, and you can reduce the speed on the play-back, and even select a certain portion that you want to listen to.

Frank

EDIT: I am by no means suggesting you need to spend $28-62k, to match the YDP-121, no way. I just wanted to share my Steinway experience I had today, there's a whole range of pianos I didn't try out.

------------ end of "cut and paste"----------

Truxillo:
I agree with your statement about the polyphony, but how can you said that it will take more than $8000.00 acoustic to get the sound and feel of a $1099 YPD-121 digital even a $6000.00 digital won't sound or feel like an acoustic piano, unless you are deaf and not able to feel the keys on the piano.
No hables pendejadas.

PendejoNOF,

I'll stick to what I said about me being unhappy with a $4,000.00 piano, I'll take my YDP-121 over a cheap piano that is going to cost a few thousand dollars any day. My savings can go into lessons or a nice accustic piano in the future.

About the $8,000.00 piano, note that I put in paranthesis the following (..all prices in retail..) that would endup being, what ? a 6-4k piano? I guess you missed that.

I have never seen nor will I ever pay 6k for a digital. And you're right you can not compare an $8k acustic (sale price !)to the YDP-121. I'll make that more clear next time I post.

Thank you for pointing that out.

TRUJILLO,

The reason why a digital piano can not sound identical to an A-C-O-U-S-T-I-C piano is:
Acoustic pianos produce overtones when you play, digitals don't.
Acoustic pianos have a soudboard that vibrates and amplify the sound, digitals have speakers.
The action on a piano like the YPD-121 is so faraway from the action on an acoustic piano that the only thing that is going to happen is... if you practice on that piano while your learning you won't develop a proper technique to play the piano.

No seas pendejo e informate antes de hablar.

Richmaninof:

A cheap piano is not going to give a beginner (go back and read the original question about a $1500.00 max. budget for a daughter) an advantage over a the YDP-121.

I have only been playing the piano for a year (a have a music background in a couple of other instruments). And I can not see the advantage of a cheap piano over the YDP-121, CAN NOT!. I can however see several notches of improvement over the YDP-121 when playing a fine piano (you don't have to be an expert to feel this).

About the action and it's affect on technique, I am aware of this (a lot has already been said and written about this). I need some one to teach me more about this (hands-on).

There is a lot of mystery in a piano to a beginner that she/he must get over. For example, what is a middle C, an F, an Octive, a quarter note, the treble, the bass, a C major Scale, what is it like getting down the mechanics, after you got down the mechanics of a piece how do you get it down musically. The DYNAMICS, this is where a good action really comes into play !!! -- p, pp, ppp, fff, etc. (even people with great pianos are trying to master this part). And before you even get to the dynamics how about learning how to read notes !?! (this is what a beginner should be doing).

--------------------------------------------

<<< Back to Tikidude >>> I have given my reply to you with a lot of thought and heart.

I hope your daughter and your family will get a lot of pleasure and excitement from what ever piano purchase you do make. I think you will find sufficient information in these boards to be able to go out and find the right piano for your family.

Frank

It is not about dynamics, we know she won't work on dynamics until latter, is about developing enough strength on her fingers so she can play a real piano.
If you want to know which piano is a good low-end digital, try a Roland fp-100.

Hello Truxillo,

Thank you very much for the review on the YDP-121. We tried it out again at the local Guitar Center and this display model seemed to match the CLP840 in sound quality. It was also discounted to $895.

We were fortunate enough to encounter an experienced pianist/teacher/MIDI-master who was schooled in the classical piano methods but had no reservations about the new digital pianos. After much discussion, he recommended that we either buy the Yamaha P-120 now (to have a graded-hammer action effect) or wait until December when Yamaha will be introducing the YDP-223. He had been to NAMM 2002 and said that this new product is the successor to the YDP-121 and it will feature graded-hammer action, MIDI in/out and 64 notes of polyphony. The price point will be the same as the YDP-121 so the estimated street price will be about $1100. This very much explains all the specials that the music retailers have been having on this model.

Our daughter is doing just fine with our keyboard at home and the the accoustics at the studio. Her instructor said that she should do just fine with that combination for the next several months.

Given all this information, it looks like I know what Christmas gift she'll be getting this year. Thanks again for all the help!

- TikiDude
(aka Hans)

ha,ha, pianist, teacher and MIDI "MASTER"
working for guitar center.
you are funny tiki-dude.
You deserve a Yamaha.

Everyone deserves a Yamaha!

No one deserves a Roland... unless, you're into that sort of thing.

*shivers*

I'm sorry that you're so offended and hurt that I don't care for your advice rickmaninof.

Unfortunately, you're just not believable (not to mention naturally obnoxious). Maybe if you also went back to grade school so you could learn basic spelling too... :p

Anyway, I suppose if more folks bought digital pianos, they'd have no need for your services.

Ta-ta!

I bought my Jamaha for Pipty dollars

Hey Tiki-dude talking about spelling, where I come from we have gramar-school textbooks in our own language, no like other countries where they have to use English textbooks because they only have some "sort of language"

Lo siento, Bozkurt! :p It's too bad you couldn't read more of your grammar books.

Now run along and try to behave yourself. Try posting to the other forums. Maybe some other folks might think you have something useful to say.

I don't get it...

Hey Dude, I don't get it neither,

My gramma books weren't written in English,so what's your point. I am waiting for you to start making sense. By the way if you don't like my suggestions don't get out of your way, just ignore them. I am just having so much fun!

Gee Bozkurt! I guess I've really yanked your chain. You're rather upset!

Tch! Tch! Now behave and get a life. You're not impressing anyone here and there's no room on the boards for a "zonta". I'm sure the folks in the non-digital piano forums "might" appreciate you more.

Have "fun" (y adios, muchacho)! :p