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#745833 - 08/24/04 10:32 AM I had an idea, could we do this?
jdsher Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/04
Posts: 643
Loc: Plano, Texas
I was thinking about the holiday season coming up and wondering what charities to consider. This crazy idea popped into my head. How difficult would it be to create a Piano World CD? We could have some of our more accomplished players post their MP3s for the members to vote on which to include on the CD. Then we could ask everyone to pitch in a couple of dollars to make a 1000 CD production that we could sell on Franks website. We could then donate the profits to some worthy(non-religious) cause for the holidays. I would love to give this kind gift to my family and friends. Anyone think we could do this?
Jon
_________________________
"In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Albert Einstein

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Piano & Music Accessories
#745834 - 08/25/04 02:14 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
ycul Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/23/04
Posts: 1402
Loc: U.K.
Yep.
Having said that I don't think anyone would wanna hear me play piano! I'm willing to do anything else that could be useful though. (Within reason ;\) )
_________________________
How now, brown cow.

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#745835 - 08/25/04 04:28 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
kenny Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 7051
Great idea.
I'd imagine with the global reach there are a lot of good players and recording freaks here.
It would be funny if all the playing was at a high level, then one track was really awful.
How would we tell one person his or her playing was too poor to be included?
At a piano party it ain't so bad cause it is over in 3 minutes, forever.
On a CD you'd have to hear the bad track over and over.
And the technical quality would be all over the place.
Piano quality and condition, mic quality and placement, pianos out of tune, etc.

Then there's the money factor.
I doubt we would even break even, without marketing.
Then again, it *is* a unique and charming idea that may garner funding and even publicity, the best advertizing.
It would require a lot of work by a few people.
Instead of being a money maker it would have to be a labor of love.

I know I sound like I am poo pooing the idea; I'm not.
It is a great idea.
It just needs to be fleshed out.

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#745836 - 08/25/04 04:28 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
lb Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 1731
Loc: Indiana
ycul

You are not as liberal as I thought. ;\)

lb

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#745837 - 08/25/04 04:59 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Rich Galassini Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/28/01
Posts: 9219
Loc: Philadelphia/South Jersey
Very cool idea. My first thoughts were also Kenny's, although CD production has cheapened incredibly even within the past year.

Lets keep talking.
_________________________
Rich Galassini
Cunningham Piano Co.
Phila, Pa.
Dir. Line (215) 991-0834
rich@cunninghampiano.com
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#745838 - 08/25/04 05:03 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Tom--K Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/27/03
Posts: 5934
We are the Pianoworld, we are the pianists
We are the ones who tinkle on the ivories
so let's start playing...

To be sung in the best "Bill Murray" imitation voice possible.

Seriously, though a good idea.

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#745839 - 08/25/04 05:12 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
kenny Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 7051
And if they don't include me I can say, "Those Bastards, They Killed Kenny!"

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#745840 - 08/25/04 05:18 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Piano World Offline



Registered: 05/24/01
Posts: 5585
Loc: Parsonsfield, ME (orig. Nahant...
Great idea, but we would need a lot of help.

We certainly have enough talented members, and our online store can provide the distribution channel, but we would definitely need technical and promotional help.

I've worked with sound engineers in a new media group, there's a lot of work to laying down tracks and mixing them.

All challenges we could overcome.
The biggest challenge would be choosing the charity to donate profits to (if there were any profits).

I think Kenny is right, it would have to be a labor of love.

Do we have any members familiar with the recording industry?

How many people would be willing to submit their playing?
Remember, we have a "Members Recordings" forum, and I haven't seen much activity there...
http://www.pianoworld.com/ubb/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?/forum/29.html

Let's keep the dialogue going.
_________________________
- Frank B.
Founder / Host
www.PianoWorld.com
www.PianoSupplies.com
Find Us On:
Facebook.com/PianoWorldDotCom
Twitter.com/PianoWorld
www.youtube.com/PianoWorldDotCom
Skype: PianoWorldDotCom
Estonia L-190, Yamaha P-80, Hammond XK-3, Hammond A-100, Estey 1895 Pump Organ
-------------------------
It's Fun To Play the Piano ... PLEASE Pass It On!
And please invite everyone you know to join our piano forums!
Coming to Maine? We're in Parsonsfield (southwest) let's get together!


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#745841 - 08/25/04 06:02 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
MizMelody2001 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/06/04
Posts: 230
Loc: USA
Bylli Crayone runs his own independent record label just ourside of Boston. He does PR professionally as well as being a dance/club music artist. He has a lot of valuable connections in the music field and just might be willing to help. I'll help in any way I can. It sounds like a great idea!
_________________________
www.mizmelody.clubfreestyle.net

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#745842 - 08/25/04 06:15 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
apple* Offline


Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 19862
Loc: Kansas
I vaguely remember Derick (I think) mentioning reviving the 'Make a Wish' program.

I love the idea of a charitable opportunity for our 'group'.

I'd buy a CD. I'd also buy a Piano World Sweatshirt.
_________________________
accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, Õun (apple in Estonian)

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#745843 - 08/25/04 06:56 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
kenny Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 7051
Frank
I'm not sure my playing would reach the bar but I'd give it the old college try. \:\)

How would we pick?
Solely on technical level?
Musicality?
Most advanced pieces?
How "good" of a forum member he/she is?
Post count?
What if 10 new members rush to join who are great players, and win but have a post count of 2?
Lowest member number?
How much they have supported Pianoworld financially?
Would members just submit a tape?
Would members travel to a studio?
Would we rent time in a local studio at our own expense?

All classical, or jazz and other styles?

How about a CD of liberals and one CD of conservatives? \:\)

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#745844 - 08/25/04 07:08 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Piano World Offline



Registered: 05/24/01
Posts: 5585
Loc: Parsonsfield, ME (orig. Nahant...
 Quote:
Originally posted by kenny:
Frank
I'm not sure my playing would reach the bar but I'd give it the old college try. \:\)

How would we pick?
Solely on technical level?
Musicality?
Most impressive pieces?
How "good" of a forum member he/she is?
Post count?
What if 10 new members join who are great players, and win but have a post count of 2?
Lowest member number?
How much money they have spend at Pianoworld?
Would members just submit a tape?
Would members travel to a studio?
Would we rent time in a local studio at our own expense?

All classical, or jazz and other styles?

How about a CD of liberals and one of conservatives? \:\) [/b]
 Quote:
How would we pick?
I can set up polls that only allow people to vote one time for each entry.

I think it should be based on musicality.
If enough people enjoy it, it's good.

Recording would be a challenge. Although a number of members have very nice pianos, I doubt many people have good recording equipment.

There have been posts in the past about techniques for recording the piano, somebody should dig up those threads for us (hint, hint).

I think the music should span the spectrum, after all this is PIANO WORLD
_________________________
- Frank B.
Founder / Host
www.PianoWorld.com
www.PianoSupplies.com
Find Us On:
Facebook.com/PianoWorldDotCom
Twitter.com/PianoWorld
www.youtube.com/PianoWorldDotCom
Skype: PianoWorldDotCom
Estonia L-190, Yamaha P-80, Hammond XK-3, Hammond A-100, Estey 1895 Pump Organ
-------------------------
It's Fun To Play the Piano ... PLEASE Pass It On!
And please invite everyone you know to join our piano forums!
Coming to Maine? We're in Parsonsfield (southwest) let's get together!


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#745845 - 08/25/04 07:12 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
netizen Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/02/01
Posts: 1926
Loc: New York
I like this idea !
_________________________
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."-- Theodore Roosevelt

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#745846 - 08/25/04 08:19 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
jdsher Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/04
Posts: 643
Loc: Plano, Texas
Kenny: What I imagined was that regular members would record their own playing. If this means borrowing some studio time or simply micing their own pianos at home and converting them to MP3s. I've listened to old recordings of Horowitz from the 40's that don't sound terrible because a studio engineer can clean up alot of background noise, etc. What might end up happening is some of the recording folks who hang out here might jump in with free studio time, or a referral to another colleague in a different city or state that is willing to donate some time and expertise. The payoff for them is 1) feeling good about donating or 2) having their name on a CD liner.
As far as which recordings to pick, I would recommend that we have members send in a home recording first for forum members to vote on. Pick a weeks time for the voting to occur in. At the end we pick the top ten plus or minus one or two pieces for running length. Then we work on sound quality issues. If some of the home recordings are good enough we leave them alone, if not then we figure out how to make them better.
I think we should except all styles of music including original work.
"What if 10 new members join who are great players, and win but have a post count of 2?"
In this case it will be up to the forum members to vote their conscience. If they believe someone has registered just to self promote then let them respond by not voting.
Jon
_________________________
"In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Albert Einstein

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#745847 - 08/25/04 09:04 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
ycul Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/23/04
Posts: 1402
Loc: U.K.
Good, practical thoughts there. I agree about the independant recording. I've done quite a bit of that over the last few years. Because of the advances in digital technology it's now pretty straightforward to get a good quality sound recording relatively cheap.
All any members interested in submitting a recording would have to do is get their hands on a half decent mike-an NT2 maybe and some kind of digital recording medium like a mini-disc/portable D.A.T. or a hard disc recorder. I hope I'm not irritating anyone by making this sound easier than it might be for some people, I'm probably a bit spoilt with the company I keep.
One of the last recording sessions I did was *remote* and was flown into the track by the engineer at a later date.
The voting system sounds very fair.
Me and my fella could design some C.D. covers btw.
_________________________
How now, brown cow.

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#745848 - 08/25/04 09:06 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
ycul Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/23/04
Posts: 1402
Loc: U.K.
 Quote:
To be sung in the best "Bill Murray" imitation voice possible.
Hmmmmmm... I watched Lost in Translation the other night. That bloke is gorgeous!

Apologies for thread diversion. ;\)
_________________________
How now, brown cow.

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#745849 - 08/25/04 09:13 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
jodi Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 6959
Loc: The Evergreen State (WA)
Off topic: I want a sweatshirt. Do we have sweatshirts?

\:\)

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#745850 - 08/25/04 09:20 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
netizen Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/02/01
Posts: 1926
Loc: New York
 Quote:
Originally posted by jodi:
Off topic: I want a sweatshirt. Do we have sweatshirts?

\:\) [/b]
I want a mousepad.
_________________________
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."-- Theodore Roosevelt

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#745851 - 08/25/04 09:26 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
RealPlayer Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/02/03
Posts: 2332
Loc: NYC
People keep telling me I should record my piano. Maybe this is the chance to do it. Somebody else would have to bring in some equipment, though, 'cause all I have is a Sony TCD-5 cassette unit and one el cheapo electret mic.

We may have to worry about street noise, but a weekend or evening would mitigate that somewhat.

Good idea, Jon!!
_________________________
Joe

www.josephkubera.com

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#745852 - 08/25/04 09:40 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Derick Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/03/02
Posts: 3290
Loc: New York
 Quote:
Originally posted by Piano World:

Recording would be a challenge. Although a number of members have very nice pianos, I doubt many people have good recording equipment.[/b]
Therein lies the biggest challenge. I made a recording with new, $500+ mics that I borrowed, and it's awful. I did everything I could with the .mp3 editing software I have but to no avail. I guess you simply can't turn aluminium into gold no matter how sophisticated the technology is.

In any case, I would not be willing to submit a recording as I'm looking to make a CD of my own. If this guy, Patrik , can and be written up in the NY Times, I should receive rave reviews from every major newspaper across the country. And the PianoWorld CD should skyrocket to #1 within days of its release. The entire forum will be invited to the Grammy's next year and Frank will give the acceptance speech. (BTW, I'm almost positive Patrik is fibbing... I think he's playing a digital Imperial, or else the recording sucks big time. The piano sounds like hell IMHO.)

Nevertheless, I'd be happy to donate the green stuff.

Derick
_________________________
Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good, you'll have to ram them down people's throats.

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#745853 - 08/25/04 09:40 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
jdsher Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/04
Posts: 643
Loc: Plano, Texas
Go for it RealPlayer. Let your recording be the first one. Have you thought about what piece of music you would like to record?
Jon
_________________________
"In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Albert Einstein

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#745854 - 08/25/04 10:46 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
piqué Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/15/01
Posts: 5484
what a great idea. i'd love to submit a recording but i am clueless on the technology end. maybe those of you who know what you are doing can tell the rest of us a simple and inexpensive way we can produce a decent recording and get it online.

it will be like an electronic piano party! what fun!
_________________________
piqué

now in paperback:


Grand Obsession: A Piano Odyssey

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#745855 - 08/25/04 10:56 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Jeff Bauer Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/28/03
Posts: 1718
Loc: Los Angeles
I would be willing to contribute.

Pique, I don't know if MP3s would be the best way to go because of compatability with most CD players.. but of course if enough people get involved, it may be the only way to avoid having multiple CDs (or maybe multiple CDs isn't a bad thing).

I have a basic recording studio at home, and a portable hard disk recording device +2 mics. If anyone in the area wanted to cut some tracks, I could probably find a way to accomodate them.

Gives me a reason to fire up the studio again, something my wife has been nagging me to do (and myself).
_________________________
Jeff Bauer | Keyboard Concepts

Yamaha | Schimmel | Bösendorfer | Knabe | Seiler | Restored Steinway

BauerHouse Productions

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#745856 - 08/25/04 11:03 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Derick Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/03/02
Posts: 3290
Loc: New York
But .mp3's are easily converted into .wav files which eliminates the compatibility problem.

Derick
_________________________
Don't worry about people stealing your ideas. If your ideas are any good, you'll have to ram them down people's throats.

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#745857 - 08/25/04 11:09 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
kenny Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 7051
 Quote:
Originally posted by Angelino Jazzer:
I would be willing to contribute.


I have a basic recording studio at home, and a portable hard disk recording device +2 mics. If anyone in the area wanted to cut some tracks, I could probably find a way to accomodate them.
[/b]
Very gracious of you Angelino.
I considered taking you up on it.
Then I remembered when I used to record myself on guitar.
I would record a million takes.
For some reason recording makes me more nervous than playing for people; I would make a lot of mistakes.
I think this is is best done alone.
Then I am only wasting my own time.

You may want to rethink the offer.
It may eat up a lot of your time. \:\(

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#745858 - 08/25/04 11:09 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Axtremus Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/29/03
Posts: 6180
I want to relay my experience with another Internet community where we have put out a CD compilation containing works by community members.

It worked out like this:
  • Every submission MUST have a release form stating that the submitter has the right to make the submission and that he gives the community the right to use the track "as is" for the sole purpose of including it in the CD compilation. This is to protect the community from intellectual property law suite.
  • Every submission is advised to stay within 5 minutes.
  • Every one submitting will send a $75 cheque along - the cheque will get cashed if the submission makes it to the CD and AFTER the CD's are pressed.
  • Every submission includes the following: The name of the band/artist/composer, the title of the track, a short description/write-up about the music, and optionally a picture.
  • There's a design firm designated to design the CD liner/booklet, and an audio engineering studio designated to do the "mastering" work for the CD.
  • Those whose works are included (and paid $75) would get 25 copies of the CD's (including liner notes and covers, of course) for them to do as they wish. Some number of CD's are retained for sale by the community to help with fund-raising.
  • There is an exception for "financially struggling artists" where by the can submit a track for free, but if their track makes it to the CD, they'll get only 1 copy of the CD.


The above just describes what another online community went through to get their first CD compilation out (500 CD's on first pressing, if I remember right). Said community is now working on the second compilation. They did not have to reject any submission because there weren't that many to begin with for their first compilation. It's not a music-centric online community, and all submissions are original works. Furthermore, a 5-minute per track restriction (not strictly followed, just a general guideline) would allow them to accommodate 15 submissions per 75-minute CD. (Their first compilation ended up with 14 tracks - longest track is 12 min. 10 sec., shortest track is 54 sec., 10 tracks are under 4 min.) It will require patience -- it took them a year to pull off the first compilation, mostly waiting for folks to complete their recordings and submit tracks, get all the release forms in line, etc. Professional CD pressing was actually the easier part for them.

Their model may or may not work for Piano World - because Piano World is music-centric, and without restricting submissions to original work, pretty much any one can play any old classical composition in public domain and submit something. Furthermore, a Beethoven sonata can easily eat up half an audio CD.

On the up side, Piano World members appear to be financially better off - so funding such a project won't be as challenging. With sufficient funding, a multi-CD compilation may be possible.

People do have the tendency to over-estimate the number of folks who would be willing to submit recordings. But, if Piano World indeed gets too many submissions to fill an audio CD, how about making MP3 CD's instead. If that's not enough, how about pressing DVD's with MP3 files on it?

That said, I also believe that this would most likely have to be a labor of love. And, yes, I would support such a project with a submission and some humble amount of green stuff (no, I'm not going to play Greensleeves). \:\)
_________________________
www.PianoRecital.org -- my piano recordings

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#745859 - 08/25/04 11:29 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
kenny Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 7051
I am not familiar with recording on a computer.
Would these musical pieces have to be played through without editing?

Or do people cut and paste together the best sections from each of their 200 takes?

Frankenmusic.

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#745860 - 08/25/04 11:49 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Piano World Offline



Registered: 05/24/01
Posts: 5585
Loc: Parsonsfield, ME (orig. Nahant...
Thanks Axtremus,

Nice overview of what we might expect to run into. And good point about the release forms!
_________________________
- Frank B.
Founder / Host
www.PianoWorld.com
www.PianoSupplies.com
Find Us On:
Facebook.com/PianoWorldDotCom
Twitter.com/PianoWorld
www.youtube.com/PianoWorldDotCom
Skype: PianoWorldDotCom
Estonia L-190, Yamaha P-80, Hammond XK-3, Hammond A-100, Estey 1895 Pump Organ
-------------------------
It's Fun To Play the Piano ... PLEASE Pass It On!
And please invite everyone you know to join our piano forums!
Coming to Maine? We're in Parsonsfield (southwest) let's get together!


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#745861 - 08/26/04 10:03 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
jdsher Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/04
Posts: 643
Loc: Plano, Texas
Great post Axtremus. Should we begin asking members to start posting recording now? Once we reach 25-30 recordings, then we can take a poll on which to included, or we could include all on either DVD, multiple CDs, or MP3s.
Thanks for all the great input.
Jon
_________________________
"In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Albert Einstein

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#745862 - 08/26/04 11:34 AM Re: I had an idea, could we do this?
Brendan Offline


Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 5307
Loc: McAllen, TX
I will submit something for this.
_________________________
http://www.BrendanKinsella.com

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