I want one(model 408). I create music based on the sustain portion of the piano. The harmonic series of this scale design must sing like an angel.

I'm with Jazzwee. I think their IS a sizable but hard to reach market.

That is one of my consulting specialties.

I'd market thru secondary means such as decorators and real estate agents.

My opinion, for what little it is worth, is that people have far too much time on their hands... More practice, less pickiness about the instrument itself

jazzwee:

Thanks for your comment! Every product has it's price, and unfortunately there will always exist some imbalance between wealthy "ignorants" who buy an item just for bragging, and the regular people who could use, but can't afford the product. However, we intend to provide a number of instruments as awards for music competion winners, for instance, as well as we have developed other concepts, which I can't disclose at this point in time, how to provide access to this instrument as well to the none-wealthy people.

Zormpas:
Thank you for your suggestion! I have investigated ideas how to replace the "primitive" tuning pin / pin block concept, but have not yet discovered any solution that would satisfactory solve the following problem:

In order to fine-tune the piano, to manage frequency changes of the slightest imaginable little bit, at the same time making sure that the tension of the string's vibrating part AND the tension in the part from the pressure bar or agraffe to the variable fixing point of the string (at present: the tuning pin), which leads along at least one more major friction point, can be balanced, you need to "feel" the reaction of the string. In other words, the system must be elastic to some extent, it can't be absolutely static. Any kind of screw stringer system, in this regard, is too static. If you don't have the sensitive, manual control over the reaction of the string on your mechanical input, you cannot define at what point the tension between those two parts of the string is equally balanced, which inevitably leads to fast detuning of the instrument. This problem typically occurs at old pianos, if the strings are too rusty and therefore "stick" to the agraffe / pressure bar - you can tune such pianos only approximately, far from precision, and detuning occurs within shortest time.

So, what can we do...?!?

I always thought some sort of micro metal gear could be used as a tuning pin.

You got me - I'm just a Belly Dancer by night, and work in an engineering field by day; I'm certainly not a piano designer! Anecdotal evidence says that screw stringers were known for their tuning stability. But that's all I know on the subject - "there's gotta be a better way!"

I think it's absolutely gorgeous and as soon as I win the lottery, I'll be putting in my order!
I like black for the color, but I could also see it being done in some of the high end metallic car finishes where the color seems to vary in different light.

You know once its available you will see it in a movie. I could just see it in a James Bond flick...

paul milando:

You are absolutely right - it sings like an angel! Very nice analogy!

I will add you to our buyer's list, thank you for your clear and positive statement!!


Steve Cohen:
Thanks for your suggestion! In fact, we do intend to market through secondary means, as part of our marketing concept, for instance, architects. Sure it's worth to consider other professions as well, as you mention.


Mark:
To design some functioning gear as such is no problem, the problem is what I described in my answer to Zormpas. Anyway, I have not ruled out to continue thinking about solutions to this problem, just haven't had any workable idea yet.

The 3D rendering is stunning. I hope I will get the opportunity to play one someday.

Herr Klavins,
The 370 is incredible. The two-story design looks good. On first listening to the Chaconne, I found the tone was tinny in the register of the opening chords. The bass is thunderous, and the upper register is clear. But I wonder if the microphone placement affected the tone to sound tinny in the middle register. The other pieces on the CD page did not sound tinny, and you could hear a lot more of the room's reverb.
You could sample the 370 for a software program like Ivory.
I did not find the tone that different from current pianos except for the tremendous bass.
I found the photo of signatures on the plate to be somewhat like a tree bark inscribed with people's names. It takes away from the aesthetic.

As for the 408, I do not like the overall design, but I think it would fun to play and also enjoyable as it is to play any high-end instrument. I like black legs with a bronze plate, instead of black/black or bronze/bronze.
The pedals seem a bit big.

What about the matching bench?

And is the lid's height adjustable?

Your website would be great if you had a 3D model that could be rotated and viewed from any angle and zoomed in and out. Having to click on all those photos individually is a bit tedious.

Are the keys longer than on a 9' grand? (the distance from the front to the hammer) I know that distance increases with the size of grands, and it seems like it should on a 13' foot piano. How does this affect the action?

Based on the pictures (not having heard it) I think it is fabulous in every way.

Finally an original thinker.
Kudos to you!

The idea of supporting the lid at three height-adjustable points to focus the sound in any direction 360 degrees around the piano is brilliant and elegant in its simplicity.
The best engineering is simple yet new.

I’m looking forward to hearing more about this innovative solution.
May you breath new life into a stuffy old institution.

I wish you great success.

I think Australia's Sydney Opera House, with it's sailboat architectural theme will want to buy the first one.

That 408 has to be the best example of thinking outside the box. What a refreshing design and look. I wonder how you project its weight will come in compared to 9-foot concert grands? I could see this type of sleek design, perhaps in a 7 to 9 foot size, being popular in modern-oriented homes where a more massive look might be out of place. Agree with Steve Cohen that decorators might eat this up. Does lowering the lid have a similar quieting effect as on a traditional grand?

The 370 I could picture in a church across from a nice pipe organ. Perhaps it might even have a chance of holding its own in a duet.

Howard

Re the tone, the clarity of the bass is impressive in both soft and loud passages of the downloads, and its tone is pleasing.

Like jwjazz, to my ears the opening passages of the Chaconne d-moll sounded tinny and I was bothered by what seems like excessive reverb and did wonder about microphone placement.

I A/B'd the 370 against Eric Himy's rendition of Schumann's Arabesque in C, played on the Steingraeber 272. Each time I was struck immediately by the full, round tone of the its melody notes. A download is here.

You've already posted that you're working on improving the tone for your 408. If you're open to bringing in outside expertise, I'd suggest contacting Delwin Fandrich ("Del" on Piano World). Del designed the string scale for the Rubenstein twelve footer. The specifications for that piano include Sitka spruce for the soundboard and 21 ribs. That Sitka/many ribs combination is right out of Del Fandrich's posts on the Piano Technicians Guild archives.

David, #1) Yes absolutely although I'm glad its not my funds that are used in this experiment. Even if you succeed in building the world's greatest piano can you sell enough of them at 350K? I'd love to try this piano and would really try not to like it better than my D because I could never afford one. As for the looks I would prefer if the piano used some traditional elements like the legs. I would make the piano black gloss and the inside of the lid reflective. I'm not sure I like the telescope, could it be thinner? Are there electric motors to raise and lower the lid? The edges appear delicate, I think you need a rather sturdy rub rail (like a boat) to protect the edges and the lid needs to cover everything if it does not already. So when its in NY give me call.

David Klavins: I strongly encourage you to pursue your completely impractical goal. At the very least, you might (a) influence other piano innovations and/or (b) actually make some money. All innovations face resistance. Geniuses ignore that.

I think $340k is not much for an extremely wealthy person to pay for a very rare status symbol, and I agree that you should make that population your target market. For not much more, such a person could adopt me, and I'll be happy to play the thing.

As for color, two words: tiger stripes.

Oh, and another thing: did I count only 88 keys?
Can you tell us why you didn't extend the range?

How interesting! The first person in 46 posts to think outside that[/b] box! What traditionalists we are!

Regards,

Steve Cohen, the marketing through decorators etc. is a great idea. Or getting featured in HGTV, Architectural Digest or something like that because it is a different market. Give it a little endorsement from some major musician (since they won't know anything about the musical qualities). If I had the bucks, maybe I'd swing for this instead of a new Rolls Royce this year.

i love it and hereby volunteer to test market the piano.. no charge to you.

gorgeous works of art on that site.

I am glad to hear this. I guess, I am more of a function over form kind of guy so if the unusual design is there because of the function rather than the form, I am all for it.

As far as the look, if I happen to be in the bracket of people who can afford it, I certainly would not hesitate to get one as long as it performs better than its competitor.

Price wise, it is not so outrageous considering the prices of other smaler limited edition pianos from other manufacturers.

I am curious to see what the audience's reaction would be if it sits in a traditional concert hall. I could see it perfectly at home in modern hall like Disney Hall.

I love the white lid but may be less blue and more black and gold like traditional piano and may be chrome or metallic grey legs might make it a bit more traditional and darker wood colored sound board would be nice.

hmmm.... only if I have 350k and money to build a house big enough to accomodate it

I hope in the future, the design/look might be triggered down to smaller, more regular home and budget friendly model

Hello everybody, thank you for your input! I will answer and comment on the latest post shortly, at present I'm too occupied with the subject itself.

jwjazz:

As you have noticed, the recordings sound different. Actually, I experimented with different types of microphones, trying to achieve a tonal result closer to the character of the music recorded. As I have stated before, the Model 370 is the very first prototype of piano design, and given this fact, it surely does not represent the quality level as the final product will provide. After having analyzed it carefully, I have decided on quite a number of changes, which altogether will result in a significant overall improvement of this instrument - as the Model 408 will surely prove.

You are right – a matching bench for this piano will be designed and provided as well.

The lid will be adjustable at any desired angle, each of the 3 telescopes will be hydraulically operated and will allow free positioning of the lid, according to the acoustic requirements of the given purpose / situation / room.

A rotating 3D model would provide too much of certain details, which at this point I consider not suitable to disclose.

The keys are longer, compared to the 9-foot grand, of course, but given the new keyboard system I have developed this will not affect the touch in any negative way, since the keys will weigh much less than the traditional ones.


Kenny:
Thanks for the kudos!
I agree, the Sydney Opera House should definitely have a look at the Model 408…


hv:
The Model 408 will not weigh significantly more than a 9-foot grand, due to the materials utilized.
Lowering the lid will have a comparable effect on the sound like at a traditional grand, yes; additionally, there will be implemented a new solution to decrease the loudness level, without affecting the touch.


FogVilleLad:
Regarding the string scaling and soundboard construction of the 408 I have my very own ideas, which I believe will work out fine. Though I am always open for discussions, cooperation with other experts and good ideas, I prefer to first present the 408 as I personally consider it optimal, by means of the soundboard construction and the string scale. I have researched many years on all related factors, which has lead me to very certain conclusions and definitions. The Model 370 basically approves my respective assumptions.


LJC:
The dimensions of the telescopes are designed according to the functional requirements; there is little room to make them thinner. However, aspects like this will be subject to possible revisions during the prototype manufacturing process.


Paul Kolodner:
Thank you for the encouragement! As for me personally, I will not rest, nor retreat until the 408 is introduced to the piano world!


BruceD, Paul Kolodner:
I do not absolutely rule out extending the scale at a later point, if there would be a significant demand for this. I consider 88 keys being the “natural” tonal scale of the piano. In fact, tones below 27 Hz don’t sound like tones any more, the lower you go the more you begin to hear the single waves of the frequency, instead of a smooth tone. It’s the same with acoustics, as it is with optics: if a movie shows less than 24 pictures per second, the eye catches lined up single pictures, instead of a clear movie.


apple*:
Thanks for your compliments, and thank you for your kind offer, we will remember it!


bkkmd:

Thanks for your input! Regarding a smaller model – the main problem would be the decrease in sound quality, since the sound quality of the piano in large part depends on the size of the soundboard, as well as on the length of the strings (in particular for a clear and pure sound of the bass register).

Innovators always face substantial obstacles. All the best with your daring, innovative design.

This is absolute the first modern looking grand I like. Way better than the porsche design etc. I've seen so far (I agree.. I've not seen it all). I even like it more then the looks of a traditional grand. I would only add supporting beams for the pedals (from the two front legs of the piano to the box that contains the pedals) because I always worry some day I will kick by accident the box from underneath the piano. It seems so fragile.

I'd like the current colour and a deep "red" colour (for the blue parts) would be nice too (more classical looking).

For the 370 model you should target your marketing on large churches! It could do wonders in accompaniment a 1200 voices. And as someone mention stand it's own against a descent pipe-organ. However you should add some classical features to the structure to sell it (the number of modern looking churches is pale compared to the traditional looking ones). Churches have the money to buy such a instrument as well (real pipe-organs are way more expensive) I’ve heard the sound samples I’m truly no expert but it sounded nice to me.

double post

Will the lid be glass?

Is is flat or curved to focus the sound?

Could it be of a material that would reflect the sound yet bend to allow the curve be adjustable for even more flexibility in directing the sound?

FogVilleLad: Thank you!!


Pevawi:
Thank you for your thoughts!
I agree, the Model 370 as an integrated version would fit in churches very well, and I’m thinking of multi-purpose centers, conference halls and alike, which generally do not have the space for a concert grand piano, but do host musical events sometimes.


Kenny:
The lid will be of composite material, glass would weigh too much at this dimension. It is curved (concave), which serves a better sound reflection, and in combination with the different angles that it can be positioned at (by the telescopes), it will be possible to adjust it optimally according to the given purpose. To construct the lid for the curve to be adjustable would generate problems by means of stability (in itself, it has to be 100% non-vibrating), and I think it is simply not necessary because the given curve is designed for an optimal reflection of sound already.

when do you think it will be ready? I'll need a couple weeks notice to arrange putting the Estoniette in my bedroom.

Doesn't it go:

If you build it, they will come!

If a pianist plays this new design and they like the sound, the action, and it inspires them...you're gold.

There aren't enough pianos in the world as it is, so build on, bro!