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#84251 - 06/05/08 04:33 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
neerod Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/20/08
Posts: 8
Loc: Singapore
Thanks cluster.

I will check. (Does watches count as metalic). If it's the ceiling fluorescent tube causing the sound, then I'm at a loss on what to do!

The keys are the middle D key (very obvious) and the next octave D (definitely not as frequent and not as bad). After the tuning, only the middle D still has the problem (fingers crossed!). The sound comes on and off;I don't hear it on a gd day, though it usually emerge after playing for a while.

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(ads 568) Hailun Pianos

 

#84252 - 06/07/08 08:25 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
Davinci Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 131
CMK: Thanks for recommending Alvin, a very fruitful trip. A very good benchmark and now quite spoilt with too much from a good thing.

Anyway a very unpleasant experience for my piano search today and i wonder does anyone encountered similar situation elsewhere:

Went to KAWAI the 2nd time but this time at PARKWAY. Shamed on the person who attended me, mid-aged lady with badly drawn eye makeup, reluctantly open the glass door when i requested to play on the new range of K series.

When i briefly introduced myself as a begineer, i pedalled on K8 playing my little piece and there goes she said "Begineers dont use pedals" Anyway i dont give it a damn continued pedalling and moved on to K6 and then K5 and this lady continued to comment "seems you dont have a good technic cause you hit the keys hard" (i dont see what's wrong when i recalled Alvin's hitting one key so hard that freaks me a little" And then she commented i should go back to Millenium and look for the sales person that ever serviced me etc.

From the start i was very tolerant with that particular service and I was very irritated throughout when she stared at me when i played and later claimed she's not a pianist neither the sales person (when i requested a sales person to attend)

It was very upsetting the whole day for a brand that i'm in favor and yet very unhappy and disappointed by the service delievered today. And the rest of the piano search at nearby area was also disappointing as well. (Not many people know what they are selling).

And rather obvious IMO and sad to say, in Singapore the dealers' integrity and the after sales service bundles should prior than any other factors.

Anyway not giving up...will continue the west and town area soon.

Good Luck to ME

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#84253 - 06/07/08 09:15 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
satay16 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/23/08
Posts: 37
Loc: Singapore
hmm...... actually, i did not really had an enjoyable time with them at millenia walk and the center point one. they gave me this attitude like "sheesh, another play but not buying customer", which i believe made me really not want to buy from them. one of the salesgirl actually have the cheek to tell me 4 times(!!) that full songs are not allowed to be played. it really ****ed me off quite greatly.

btw, anyone of you tried parson music (times square) at hong kong? you step in, grand pianos are flooding the place like no one cares ! and you play twinkle twinkle on the fazioli(which has a hell lot of scratches) or rubbish on the steinway, no one cares. hee hee, though i have to admit, the pianos are really really poorly mantained. almost all out of tune, though the undisturbed freedom is kind of cool \:D

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#84254 - 06/07/08 09:23 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
Davinci Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 131

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#84255 - 06/07/08 09:23 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
Davinci Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 131
 Quote:
Originally posted by satay16:


btw, anyone of you tried parson music (times square) at hong kong? you step in, grand pianos are flooding the place like no one cares ! and you play twinkle twinkle on the fazioli(which has a hell lot of scratches) or rubbish on the steinway, no one cares. hee hee, though i have to admit, the pianos are really really poorly mantained. almost all out of tune, though the undisturbed freedom is kind of cool \:D [/b]
Times Square at HK which floor can you recalled? will go the next time i vist. That's pretty cool when you can really enjoy playing freely like nobody's business.

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#84256 - 06/07/08 09:24 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
Davinci Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 131

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#84257 - 06/07/08 09:54 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
satay16 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/23/08
Posts: 37
Loc: Singapore
9th floor, but be warned, the pianos there are really poorly mantained. :rolleyes:

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#84258 - 06/07/08 08:34 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
snoopycar Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 976
Loc: Singapore
 Quote:
Originally posted by Davinci:
CMK: Thanks for recommending Alvin, a very fruitful trip. A very good benchmark and now quite spoilt with too much from a good thing.

Anyway a very unpleasant experience for my piano search today and i wonder does anyone encountered similar situation elsewhere:

Went to KAWAI the 2nd time but this time at PARKWAY. Shamed on the person who attended me, mid-aged lady with badly drawn eye makeup, reluctantly open the glass door when i requested to play on the new range of K series.

When i briefly introduced myself as a begineer, i pedalled on K8 playing my little piece and there goes she said "Begineers dont use pedals" Anyway i dont give it a damn continued pedalling and moved on to K6 and then K5 and this lady continued to comment "seems you dont have a good technic cause you hit the keys hard" (i dont see what's wrong when i recalled Alvin's hitting one key so hard that freaks me a little" And then she commented i should go back to Millenium and look for the sales person that ever serviced me etc.

From the start i was very tolerant with that particular service and I was very irritated throughout when she stared at me when i played and later claimed she's not a pianist neither the sales person (when i requested a sales person to attend)

It was very upsetting the whole day for a brand that i'm in favor and yet very unhappy and disappointed by the service delievered today. And the rest of the piano search at nearby area was also disappointing as well. (Not many people know what they are selling).

And rather obvious IMO and sad to say, in Singapore the dealers' integrity and the after sales service bundles should prior than any other factors.

Anyway not giving up...will continue the west and town area soon.

Good Luck to ME [/b]
and after you left, did you see her polishing vigoriously the finger prints you letf o the piano lid ? \:D

Oh don't be bothered or discouraged by the "sales woman" style, because ...... i was treated like there this too 3 yrs ago. It makes me go back home to practising harder, polish up my scales(still working on it). and the aircon there was so cold it makes my fingers stiffen up too.

Well perhaps she has high standards...
trust her, she may be right, she has the set to think that playing the piano should be a gentle movements. Just think of it as free advise.

Hmmm.. you have to try the centerpoint branch. the china salesgirl janet is pleasantly friendly. She doesn't criticise customer playing technique.

Not suppose the play the whole movement?? is there a queue forming up to try the piano? Are there other customer at other piano trying too?
Then there should be a common understanding to play segments of movement not more that a mintue so that other customers can take turns to try.

And moreover, if you mangae to play the whole sonata with the teacher-salewoman staring at your fingering, without any mistakes, it'll be a miricle ;\) but after that you may have to listen to 30mins of lectures on playing and performance techniques... do you really want that?

I view has always been neutral, i don't like to complain and keep it to myself. Although we are the consumer(with the $$$), they way we are treated are sometimes cannot be justified.

But a "gem" is a gem, if you found a piano that speaks to you with wonderful touch and tone, don't be discourage by the poor salesmanship, just ignore it - unless they stop you from buying. Try to obtain the valuable piano by all means and have a life time satisfaction.

On the other hand, if the sales manship is fantastic, you'd have to be careful too. Because you may be bought over by the sales technique rather than by the ture value of the piano!!
just my observation.

happy hunting :p
_________________________
Hailun dealer in Johor Bahru base in Ulu Tiram
Genio Silent system installer
Piano Tuner tech +65 90228720 Singapore & JB 012 7702587

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#84259 - 06/07/08 09:24 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
macdoc Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/11/08
Posts: 51
Loc: Singapore
 Quote:
Originally posted by Davinci:
CMK: ..... Alvin, a very fruitful trip. A very good benchmark and now quite spoilt with too much from a good thing.



......, mid-aged lady with badly drawn eye makeup,

There are more than one of this kind, and not only at RP[/b] \:D

...... she stared at me when i played and later claimed she's not a pianist neither the sales person (when i requested a sales person to attend)



....... (Not many people know what they are selling).

Not a bad conclusion ......[/b]

Anyway not giving up...will continue the west and town area soon.

Thats the spirit [/b]

Good Luck to ME

More than luck, have fun! \:\) [/b]
[/b]

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#84260 - 06/08/08 09:09 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
Davinci Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 131
 Quote:

there should be a common understanding to play segments of movement not more that a mintue so that other customers can take turns to try.
I was the only customer. Perhaps the new sets are meant not to be tried on.

 Quote:

And moreover, if you mangae to play the whole sonata with the teacher-salewoman staring at your fingering, without any mistakes, it'll be a miricle ;\) but after that you may have to listen to 30mins of lectures on playing and performance techniques... do you really want that?
I played only small little pieces with my hands fumbling becoz she's staring but then she compliment i played quite well for a begineer.

 Quote:

I view has always been neutral, i don't like to complain and keep it to myself.
I didnt know piano shopping can be so much unpleasant when someone is urgently looking for instrument but yet not treated seriously.

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#84261 - 06/08/08 09:16 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
satay16 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/23/08
Posts: 37
Loc: Singapore
gee, yeah, i was the only person there too.

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#84262 - 06/08/08 07:05 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
snoopycar Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 976
Loc: Singapore
ai ya .... no problem one lah
shopping is an experience itself
ppl are not what it seems
unpleasantness is not what it seems
be more thick skin
take it easy lah \:D
_________________________
Hailun dealer in Johor Bahru base in Ulu Tiram
Genio Silent system installer
Piano Tuner tech +65 90228720 Singapore & JB 012 7702587

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#84263 - 06/09/08 02:31 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
snoopycar Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 976
Loc: Singapore
Off topic

have you ever been to a Hi-Fi shop where they sell tube-amplifier? They make friend with you, let you play your favorite CDs till contendment. Let you sit down on the comfy sofa, let you replay the certain section of Diana Kroll vocal, the brush drum sction....

And not only that, they take the effort to swap amps or swap speaker for you to differentiate the characteristics - they know that this is the kind of service that will win customers.


On the positive note, there are piano shops here in singapore that let you play till your hearts content, eventhough you have already have a piano.

They know something more - piano shopping never ends.
_________________________
Hailun dealer in Johor Bahru base in Ulu Tiram
Genio Silent system installer
Piano Tuner tech +65 90228720 Singapore & JB 012 7702587

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#84264 - 06/09/08 01:27 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
Digitus Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/06
Posts: 866
Loc: Singapore
One can be cool about the dealer's snobbery, but it doesn't excuse the poor behaviour. It leaves the visitor with a bad taste in the mouth, after having been in to the showroom, learned nothing useful (and objective) from the sales staff, and get put down or insulted in the process. And if the visitor in the future is really in the market for a piano, then that poor experience will very likely induce second thoughts about buying from that dealer.

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#84265 - 06/09/08 10:28 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
peachbbs Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 2
Loc: singapore
Hi, I'm new here. Looking for pianos for my daughter who have passed grade 3.
As I have no knowledge of piano, so I gave up the teacher's suggestion of looking for 2nd hand yamaha. Now I'm choosing from U1 and Kawayi K5. Last year they are the same price, but this year U1 remains the same , K5 increases $1000. Is the height very important? U1 is 121, K5 is 125. My daughter is still young, she can not decide which she prefers. I likes the sound of U1. But curently U1 is out of stock, have to be waiting list around 40, may only get the piano around August. Hope to get some suggestions here.

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#84266 - 06/10/08 12:09 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
macdoc Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/11/08
Posts: 51
Loc: Singapore
If you like/prefer the sound of the U1, your daughter don't mind and both of you can wait until August, then wait. You save $1000.

If you can't wait and need to get a piano today/soon, the K5 is a decent choice.

All other things being equal; quality, feel, finish etc, I do think that the taller piano should give an increased dynamic range esp on the low end. On the other hand, a "poorer" design may result in more muddled and looser sounding bass. BTW I am not a pianist either; I just listen/enjoys music and recently been thrown into the deep end of buying a piano \:\)

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#84267 - 06/11/08 03:00 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
snoopycar Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 976
Loc: Singapore
K5 U1
Both are wonderful pianos.
Try to haggle abit for discount, $1000 increase, wow! Is it due to oil price n shipping cost these days or stronger yen?? Then wait for weaker yen, then ask if got $1000 discount?
Good bargain excuses now that its great Sinagapore sales right? discount leh, can??

If both pianos are equally good(no 2 pianos are the same, even the same model), maybe you can toss a coin. Kawai, Yamaha.. to some, brand concious consumer, brand is important. It's like Sony or Panasonic, Nokia or SonyErrisson. Ppl hear about users feedback and gather product confidence level this way. The end choice is clear in some cases. For instance, i have bad experience with samsung cell phone, i tell myself i will never buy another one, although i warranty service it twice, same poor reception trouble. Service staff suspect my sim card is old. I put the same "old" sim card in a sonyEric, reception is superb. This brand aviodence is also link to "personel service" related.

Just like in piano sale and service, the initial experence tells a great deal about the product and after sale. I got the phone through starhub 24mth contract, so there isn't sales service involved - so much for off topic.

On the other hand, don't let poor sales deter you as a consumer to miss out a great product. After tuning a yamaha or kawai, i'd like to play a little of some pieces to enjoy - if circumtances allows.

for example from after tuning experience, the K5 and K6. They keys are weighted nicely, a feeling of great substance when you depress the keyboard - the touch is wonderful. The tone is also exceptionally voiced. You can hear the fullness of the tone. The texture is thick, like the whole soundboard is virbrating to yield this wholesome tone. You can hear a slight sweetness of the 2nd and 3rd harmonics. When i play the morzart K545 runing C scale, it sounded like water splashes, owner commended on my playing. I was surprise my scale was so smooth, it was not me but the kawai K6/K5 factory setting key touch was set up correctly. This impression leaves me much to desire about a kawai piano too.

Yamaha U1 is also one of my favorite piano as i have one at home. I have got accustom to the tone and think it is quite nice. Not piercing bright, strong tone, medium mellow, in terms of tone fullness, it may be still a little lagging. i accept it as it is.But i enyjoyed playing it, which it the most important.

I have own new china piano but cannot stand the sound during practising, wonder what made me buy it in the first place. It was poor pre-purchase information i guess.

Again, it is your child who is play. let him or her try and see if they can make the decision \:D

Again both are great choice. Personally, i would lean towards the K5 if budget allows.

hope that helps
_________________________
Hailun dealer in Johor Bahru base in Ulu Tiram
Genio Silent system installer
Piano Tuner tech +65 90228720 Singapore & JB 012 7702587

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#84268 - 06/11/08 12:07 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
Davinci Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 131
 Quote:
Originally posted by Digitus:
One can be cool about the dealer's snobbery, but it doesn't excuse the poor behaviour. It leaves the visitor with a bad taste in the mouth, after having been in to the showroom, learned nothing useful (and objective) from the sales staff, and get put down or insulted in the process. And if the visitor in the future is really in the market for a piano, then that poor experience will very likely induce second thoughts about buying from that dealer. [/b]
Hit to the point exactly the msg i want to deliver. Anyway let bygones be bygones...

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#84269 - 06/12/08 05:12 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
snoopycar Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 976
Loc: Singapore
let baygon be shelltox

pPssssssssssssSSSSsssss

ANyway Singapore is singapore mah..

You go to the Kopitiam counter to order something, and what do they say ??

"Wat you want" ??
Wah lau aaa .. World class man....
_________________________
Hailun dealer in Johor Bahru base in Ulu Tiram
Genio Silent system installer
Piano Tuner tech +65 90228720 Singapore & JB 012 7702587

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#84270 - 06/12/08 06:44 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
macdoc Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/11/08
Posts: 51
Loc: Singapore
Aiyah .... sometimes customers also have a part to play.

Every customer has a right to service. And all customers should expect good service. Not good service doesn't automatically means bad service. There is a difference here. Now how often does a Singaporean rewards good service where they get it? And I don't mean just tipping. There are other ways to express appreciation. If there is no appreciation, why should the sales people give good service? More sales? That is a fallacy.

Most people here, sales and customers alike, understand one paramount and absolute aspect of a sale in SG - Ai Pee, Ai Chee, Ai Tua Liap Nee. Service? Needs both hands to clap, too.

When a customer demands service, they usually gets it when they pay for it, i.e. fly First class. When one flies cattle class and gets good service, it has much to do with being a good cow ......

Elsewhere, if service is bad, the customers tend to vote with their feet or wallet. Here, bad service? If cheap, the Singaporean still buys. And then complains. Alternatives? What alternatives - cheaper or not?

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#84271 - 06/12/08 09:39 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
Davinci Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 131
HAHAHA...OK OK FULLSTOP

Here's a nice piece for everyone cello/volin accompanied by piano. Anyone has the scores for the piano part or solo? had been searching high low for it man...

Last carnival by Norihiro Tsuru (original version)
http://www.imeem.com/urbana/music/lv5qcThp/norihiro_tsuru_last_carnival/

Piano Solo Version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgmbQy7UCyE&feature=related

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#84272 - 06/12/08 09:52 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
Davinci Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/08/08
Posts: 131

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#84273 - 06/12/08 09:32 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
peachbbs Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 2
Loc: singapore
Thank you macdoc for your kind advice.
Thank you snoopycar for sharing your own experience. Although I'm not very understand about the tuning, but I like the piece of morzart K545 when my son play the violin. Hope someday my daughter can learn it and they both play together for me.
Maybe two piano are all the same good, so my daughter can not tell which she likes. After she plays K5 she said she wanted. Then Yamaha, she said she wanted again. As yamaha is the most recently visited, so she chose Yamaha:)
My husband said Yamaha lah, as so many people are in the waiting list, must be a good one. And they also give many freebies, feel good as a customer.
Anyway my experience of shoping with Kawayi is very satisfied. I went to both center point and Millenia Walk. They both have a very experienced lady to attend us. They were all privious piano teachers with twenty or thirty years experience. They play very nice piecies. Only price is not negotiable.

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#84274 - 06/12/08 09:56 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
snoopycar Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 976
Loc: Singapore
Great place to buy(try) pianos recommendations
----------------------------------------------


1)Thompson plaza Yamaha of course;
This seems to be a good place to try out their selections of grand pianos. The atmosphere in the section is nicely separated from the other upright and instruments section. You may request to try the GP and compare by saying, "may i try them and if i need any help, i'll approach you, thks". No sales pressure, no "i swear i don't take any commision boasting"


any other piano shop to recommend?
pls add on the list.
_________________________
Hailun dealer in Johor Bahru base in Ulu Tiram
Genio Silent system installer
Piano Tuner tech +65 90228720 Singapore & JB 012 7702587

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#84275 - 06/24/08 07:50 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
macdoc Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/11/08
Posts: 51
Loc: Singapore
1) Thompson Plaza Yamaha.
2) Cristofori at Bedok.

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#84276 - 06/24/08 10:02 PM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
keeferae Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 54
Loc: Singapore
Quote: Snoopycar

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have own new china piano but cannot stand the sound during practising, wonder what made me buy it in the first place. It was poor pre-purchase information i guess.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Snoopycar,

Very curious to find out which China piano you are referring to?


Quote: macdoc

-------------------------------------------------
1) Thompson Plaza Yamaha.
2) Cristofori at Bedok.
-------------------------------------------------

Hi macdoc,

Does Cristofori sells Yamaha (used or new)? I know Cristofori carries many brands - Pearl River, Young Cbang, Samick, Bechstein, Rosnich, Knabe, Albert Weber, W Hoffman plus a few others.

But I don't remember them carrying Yamaha.

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#84277 - 06/25/08 12:10 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
snoopycar Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 976
Loc: Singapore
which china piano?
ai yo.. cannot say here leh ..

If go to Bedok, try the Weber. Very nice tone and touch. For 3K plus, it's worth it.
_________________________
Hailun dealer in Johor Bahru base in Ulu Tiram
Genio Silent system installer
Piano Tuner tech +65 90228720 Singapore & JB 012 7702587

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#84278 - 06/25/08 01:09 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
RichterForever Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/06/07
Posts: 150
Loc: Singapore
Does anyone have any comments about Rosler, a range from the Petrof stable which is currently made by Hailun in their Ningbo factory in China. Friend of mine is in the market for a piano for his daughter who is just starting piano lessons. Tried the 125cm model which I thought had quite a well balanced tone and decent action going for about $4800. I must say that the internal finish is really a league below Yamaha and Kawai.
_________________________
RichterForever
Yamaha C3, Yamaha CVP 405

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#84279 - 06/25/08 05:23 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
keeferae Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 54
Loc: Singapore
Quote: Snoopycar
-------------------------------
which china piano?
ai yo.. cannot say here leh ..
-------------------------------

Hi Snoopycar,

As you have said earlier "It was poor pre-purchase information i guess". I think fellow forum members will appreciate more info or views. I am sure you are aware that there are quite alot of "sparring" in this forum on the "likes" and "dislikes" of a particular piano or brand. So, I don't see any harm mentioning the brand. Also, there are lots of piano manufactured in China and I have learnt from this forum that it is "not fair" to classify all China pianos as bad............Anyway, it's your call.

By the way, I owned a W&L 122, made by Hailun, and I am very happy with it. The sound is really nice and clear, IMHO.


Hi RichterForever,

There are some info on Petrof Rosler on an earlier thread here. May be of some interest to you.

http://www.pianoworld.com/ubb/ubb/ultimatebb.php?/topic/1/22576.html#000000
http://www.pianoworld.com/ubb/ubb/ultimatebb.php?/topic/1/21145/6.html#000148

By the way, just for your info, PianoMaster ar Geylang East carries Hailun, Wendl & Lung and a few others. Perhaps, you may want to check it out.

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#84280 - 06/25/08 11:32 AM Re: Adult Beginner in Singapore: Buying First Piano
snoopycar Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/17/06
Posts: 976
Loc: Singapore
The china piano which i mention and had not-so-good experience is not Hailun \:D

sorry to have caused any misunderstanding.
_________________________
Hailun dealer in Johor Bahru base in Ulu Tiram
Genio Silent system installer
Piano Tuner tech +65 90228720 Singapore & JB 012 7702587

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