Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad) Pianoteq
Latest Pianoteq add-on instrument: U4 upright piano
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Page 3 of 5 < 1 2 3 4 5 >
Topic Options
#943513 - 11/14/08 05:24 PM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
Only Spock would believe it could ever work that way.

80% of the populous couldn't recognize a fallacious argument if it were staring them in the face. If they had to reduce this thread to an "If A then B..." structure and solve it they wouldn't be able to codify it let alone be able to consistently and correctly apply rules of logic in a purely rational fashion.

They/We rely on proxies to make determinations, such as the reputation of those making an argument. It simply isn't smart or effective (or as piano*dad has pointed out efficient) not to do so.

Actually, it has also been proven that humans can only take decisions because we experience emotions. Persons with brain damage who are unable to experience emotion become unable to make fundamental choices and decisions because they don't have their gut to pull the trigger.

In problems that are not discrete or possible to be well defined (such as something as complex and nebulous as piano pedagogy) there will always be a gray area which needs to be processed somehow by your gray cells. They tend to run through the gut. Ignore your gut and risk your own peril.

Top
(ad) My Music Staff
Check out the new way to manage your music studio
#943514 - 11/14/08 05:44 PM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11206
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
I am interested in what questions about teaching are better answered by students rather than teachers. Could you give some examples?

- What do adult students want to learn?

Top
#943515 - 11/14/08 06:02 PM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11206
Loc: Canada
I have gone through a dozen posts, and I cannot find anyone quoting a book in discussing pedagogy, re:
 Quote:
People do not become piano teachers just by parroting the pages of a book back - and there is a lot of that going on.

Top
#943516 - 11/14/08 06:03 PM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
rocket88 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 3158
 Quote:
Originally posted by keystring:
 Quote:
I am interested in what questions about teaching are better answered by students rather than teachers. Could you give some examples?

- What do adult students want to learn? [/b]
I don't see that as a question "about" teaching, but rather what to teach.
_________________________
Music teacher and piano player.

Top
#943517 - 11/14/08 06:23 PM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
Danny Niklas Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 905
Loc: Switzerland
Just few examples. A question about how to reach proper effortless coordination to students who seems to be to tense and tight might be best answered by a non-teacher with a knowledge on Alexander Technique and body mapping than a teacher without such knowledge. A question about how to deal with a certain student on a family situation, might be best answered by a non-teacher having passed through a similar family situation, than a teacher. A question about pieces that students might like, might be better answered by a non-teacher which collects sheets and know several alternative contemporary composers for young pianists, than a teacher without such knowledge. A question about teaching courses might be best answered by a non-teacher who attended not well known but revolutionary courses, than a teacher who doesn't know about their existence. A question about answering students question about the mechanics of piano, might be best answered by a non-teacher with a deep knowledge of piano making and acoustic. Question about how to deal, from an human point of view, with certain students, might be answered by non-teachers who might have insight into dealing with people. Questions about studio policies, might best answered by the recipients of the teaching themselves. Question about sight-reading might as well be best answered by practicing sight-reading who have revolutionary insight on the topic or method to suggest, that worked for them. Ideas on how to propose active listening and concerts attending to student, might be answered by whatever person who might have interesting thoughts about motivating other or might have experience in motivating others (even if in a different field) or might remember how he/she has been motivatedin similar situations. The list of how everyone could benefit from different point of views, different perspectives and unique insight, could be infinite. It doesn't make sense to limit such resources.

Top
#943518 - 11/14/08 06:47 PM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
DeepElem Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/27/06
Posts: 366
Loc: USA
It doesn't make sense for there to be a private forum here, this is a public internet forum.

A private "teachers only" forum is what I'd expect to be provided by some piano teachers professional society. That way you know the people there are serious because they presumably had to pay dues to get access.

The only thing I don't like about non teachers arguing with teachers in the threads is that it often derails the thread. But that doesn't have anything to do with teachers and non teachers in the same forum, that's just the nature of internet forums.

Betty, I hope this doesn't diminish your participation here.
_________________________
-Buck
------
If you knew what you were doing, you'd probably be bored.
- Fresco's Law

Top
#943519 - 11/15/08 02:29 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
 Quote:
Originally posted by rocket88:
Gary, I am not trying to pick a fight, but am interested in what questions about teaching are better answered by students rather than teachers. Could you give some examples? [/b]
There was that thread about the smelly teacher, but I'd say that really belonged elsewhere anyway (notice we have no student's forum). Even with that, you need to recognize that teachers were once students but that isn't the case the other way around. tJ's examples can and should be answered by teachers.
_________________________
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.
http://keyboardclass.blogspot.com/


Top
#943520 - 11/15/08 02:57 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
Gary D. Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 4651
Loc: South Florida
 Quote:
Originally posted by rocket88:
Gary, I am not trying to pick a fight, but am interested in what questions about teaching are better answered by students rather than teachers. Could you give some examples? [/b]
If I am teaching something, I may use several different ways to explain it. The concept remains the same, the explanation is different. I need feedback to find out which explanation works best.

This is precisely why I always ask, "Which way connected best with you?"

I don't change what I teach, but I do continue to refine HOW I teach. I am often shocked at what does work, and what does not…
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#943521 - 11/15/08 03:11 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
It's pretty rare we get that type of response (the helpful 'this how you helped me understand the concept' type) on this forum. Usually, from non-teachers, it's 'no, it's like this' kinda response.
_________________________
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.
http://keyboardclass.blogspot.com/


Top
#943522 - 11/15/08 04:50 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
 Quote:
Originally posted by theJourney:
They/We rely on proxies to make determinations, such as the reputation of those making an argument. It simply isn't smart or effective (or as piano*dad has pointed out efficient) not to do so.

Actually, it has also been proven that humans can only take decisions because we experience emotions. Persons with brain damage who are unable to experience emotion become unable to make fundamental choices and decisions because they don't have their gut to pull the trigger.

In problems that are not discrete or possible to be well defined (such as something as complex and nebulous as piano pedagogy) there will always be a gray area which needs to be processed somehow by your gray cells. They tend to run through the gut. Ignore your gut and risk your own peril. [/b]
So, so true. As a teenager my heart sank when I discovered there was such a thing as rhetoric. I just couldn't believe it! I had to elucidate it for a 15 year old earlier this year. His face! Teenagers discover the rational and think they hold the power of truth in their hands. They do, but nobody wants to know.
_________________________
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.
http://keyboardclass.blogspot.com/


Top
#943523 - 11/15/08 05:11 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11206
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
It's pretty rare we get that type of response (the helpful 'this how you helped me understand the concept' type) on this forum. Usually, from non-teachers, it's 'no, it's like this' kinda response.
Do you ask your students which of several approaches helped them?

In regards to your different example, I have from time to time told my teacher if a particular thing he did was especially helpful. Would you welcome that kind of thing from your students?

In posts I often see a teacher saying that they cannot tell whether a particular thing was helpful to a student. If this is so, would it not be helpful for students to let them know? If they are excluded, how can that happen? Then teachers will keep wondering.

Top
#943524 - 11/15/08 05:16 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11206
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
Even with that, you need to recognize that teachers were once students but that isn't the case the other way around. tJ's examples can and should be answered by teachers.
A couple of questions about that. TJ's examples involve the situation of adult students with adult responsibilities. Is it likely that teachers were once students carrying adult responsibilities if they began lessons at age 7? Will they, in fact, be able to draw on any experience if that is not the case? Therefore, can it help a teacher guide an adult student by having heard experiences and what works from other adult students?

Top
#943525 - 11/15/08 05:19 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
Loath though I am to be anecdotal - I say to my students "I try loads of different ways to help you reach an understanding, that's why you need to let me know when you've 'got it'." then lots of "now, you explain it to me" or "Can you illustrate what I've just said" or "What's important about this? To what does it relate? And why?" and so on and so on until I'm convinced the point is got across.
_________________________
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.
http://keyboardclass.blogspot.com/


Top
#943526 - 11/15/08 05:22 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
Danny Niklas Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 905
Loc: Switzerland
 Quote:
Originally posted by theJourney:
Only Spock would believe it could ever work that way.

80% of the populous couldn't recognize a fallacious argument if it were staring them in the face. If they had to reduce this thread to an "If A then B..." structure and solve it they wouldn't be able to codify it let alone be able to consistently and correctly apply rules of logic in a purely rational fashion.

They/We rely on proxies to make determinations, such as the reputation of those making an argument. It simply isn't smart or effective (or as piano*dad has pointed out efficient) not to do so.[/b]
And yet your anecdote by Colin Powell proves otherwise. I think we rely on irrelevant social-mediated factors like reputation, age, gender and even skin color in order to judge, when we have no other information to base our decision on.
But as long as we have actual merits, rather than epheral often meaningless labels, to compare, then that's what we would naturally use to make an informed decision. Human nature resorts to labels and stereotypes and symbols when better basis for a choice are lacking. It's only in this society that most of us have lost a critical spirit by default in favour of total submission to government, experts and institution.

Should I choose whom to hire for a job in an hypothetical comics publishing studio, I would never choose according to his/her look, height, age, popularity, curriculum, diplomas. I would simply ask them to show me what they can actually do on a sheet. The better one, not the one collecting more "institution medals" deserve to get the job.

Top
#943527 - 11/15/08 05:22 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
 Quote:
Originally posted by keystring:
TJ's examples involve the situation of adult students with adult responsibilities. Is it likely that teachers were once students carrying adult responsibilities if they began lessons at age 7? [/b]
Yes in my case. I will admit I always think teachers, both class and individual, have missed out if they've not done a 'real' job (said as he ducks).
_________________________
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.
http://keyboardclass.blogspot.com/


Top
#943528 - 11/15/08 05:38 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11206
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
Yes in my case. I will admit I always think teachers, both class and individual, have missed out if they've not done a 'real' job.
This should be to your advantage when teaching an adult, I would think. Does it help?
I imagine though that if the adult does not carry the same amount of dedication that you did, you might be more impatient about it than a teacher who studied as a child and shrugs his shoulders saying "Oh well, adults are too busy."

Top
#943529 - 11/15/08 05:47 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
I never complain about an adult student's lack of practice. Merely point out how much a certain task requires.
_________________________
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.
http://keyboardclass.blogspot.com/


Top
#943530 - 11/15/08 06:00 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11206
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
Originally posted by keyboardklutz:
I never complain about an adult student's lack of practice. Merely point out how much a certain task requires. [/b]
I would find that helpful in planning my practicing. Thank you.

Top
#943531 - 11/15/08 06:07 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
theJourney Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 3946
Loc: Banned
One of the most useful things one of my teachers said to me in the past was "What you want to achieve takes a minimum of 2-3 hours / day, 6-7 days / week of mindful, focused effective practice. There are no shortcuts. You either want it or you don't."

Students should never have to excuse themselves to their teacher, just to themselves.

On the other hand, there is nothing more forcful like having the piece you thought you really wanted to learn ceremoniously set aside during the lesson and having something "easy & beneath you" placed on the music stand by the teacher with the remark "I think this piece is more realistic based on the amount of time and effort you are willing and able to put into your practice right now." Oops.

Top
#943532 - 11/15/08 06:17 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11206
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
- What do adult students want to learn?
---------------------------------------------

I don't see that as a question "about" teaching, but rather what to teach
Sorry, you were asking Gary specifically so I shouldn't have put my two cents in.

However, I realize that my answer could be understood two ways. If "what we want to learn" is seen in terms of repertoire or genre, such as particular pieces or classical/folk/jazz then this does not involve teaching. In case that's how you took my answer:

I was thinking in terms of some of the things that came out in recent surveys. Many adults wanted more structure, theory, technique, reading - the formal harder stuff. But only yesterday a teacher advised that many adults want the opposite of that: playing a few "songs", fake books and no reading, working relatively superficially through a sense of lack of time. This is not just repertoire, but also the entire approach to teaching itself. If the mindset of a large number of adults is different than generally supposed, would it be helpful to get this across? Or will it not make a difference?

Top
#943533 - 11/15/08 09:19 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
rocket88 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 3158
 Quote:
If the mindset of a large number of adults is different than generally supposed, would it be helpful to get this across? Or will it not make a difference? [/QB]
Sure...and those are questions I always ask my students.

Perhaps I misread yours and others focus...teachers do need much input as to what a student wants to learn, what their time commitment is, and certainly what teaching approach works.

That is all very different from having the student tell the teacher what and how much to study regarding scales, theory, technique, etc, which I thought some were advocating.
_________________________
Music teacher and piano player.

Top
#943534 - 11/15/08 09:30 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
Danny Niklas Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 905
Loc: Switzerland
 Quote:
Originally posted by rocket88:
[QUOTE]
That is all very different from having the student tell the teacher what and how much to study regarding scales, theory, technique, etc, which I thought some were advocating. [/b]
The idea was to promote open communication. The student doesn't have to be always the passive clueless recipient of someone else arbitrary instructions. The learning path can be discussed and developed openly together.

Top
#943535 - 11/15/08 09:55 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11206
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
That is all very different from having the student tell the teacher what and how much to study regarding scales, theory, technique, etc, which I thought some were advocating.
I see what you're saying, Rocket. I think it's more that many want these things, while some teachers seem to assume the opposite. I have some other thoughts, but it would be too long. Suffice it to say that I have seen the role of a student who is doing well acting as a kind of bridge, allowing a less experience student to understand this new world and then be able to mesh with lessons and his teacher. It is like initially we speak a different language and come from different planets and another adult or teen student is more - um - biworldly? This has seemed to work well. I'll leave it at that.

Ultimately we have to learn the language of the studio and the teacher, even if a teacher tries to adjust to us.

(Um, back to Gary's original question - which was teacher to teacher?)

Top
#943536 - 11/15/08 11:03 PM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
Betty Patnude Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/11/07
Posts: 4896
Loc: Puyallup, Washington
Danny, I think you like to incite riots!

When you say: "The student doesn't have to be always the passive clueless recipient of someone else arbitrary instructions", are you saying there is a victim and a perpretrator involved?

I'd like to think that we, as teachers, are more civilized than that.

Can't people just be themselves at their piano lessons, no issues, no hidden agendas, no personality conflicts - having a good time collaborating together, getting some work done, empowering each other, enjoying a musical experience together.

We're not supposed to warp them, and they are not supposed to allow themselves to be warped, and vice versa. Can't we all play nice to each other whether we are teachers or piano students, we are all human being.

A little bit of manners and self respect goes a long way toward avoiding disturbances, anyone's aggressive behavior, and embarrasing our mutual reputations.

I really like people! I think friends are former strangers.

Piano teachers are not beasts.

And, what is this...."even if the teacher tries to adjust us" about? I'm afraid to keep reading! And all this in the Piano Teacher's Forum!

Tell me again, please, how badly I misunderstand things. I can't wait to be told.

Not so, so not so!

Top
#943537 - 11/15/08 11:41 PM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
Gary D. Online   content
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 4651
Loc: South Florida
 Quote:
Originally posted by keyboardklutz:
It's pretty rare we get that type of response (the helpful 'this how you helped me understand the concept' type) on this forum. Usually, from non-teachers, it's 'no, it's like this' kinda response. [/b]
I have seen posts here and there by students of different ages telling how their teachers helped them, and what "clicked".

The problem in this medium is that communication is limited to text, with some graphics now and then and links to sound files.
 Quote:

Originally posted by keyboardklutz:
I never complain about an adult student's lack of practice. Merely point out how much a certain task requires.
I do the same thing, but I would extend this idea to high school students.

However, there are degrees of "lack of practice". For some it turns into no practice at all, most weeks. I'm not willing to continue teaching anyone when that happens.
_________________________
Piano Teacher

Top
#943538 - 11/16/08 01:19 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
 Quote:
Originally posted by Gary D.:
The problem in this medium is that communication is limited to text, with some graphics now and then and links to sound files. [/b]
When I joined PW I thought if any good is to come it would be through videos. I'm still of that persuasion.
_________________________
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.
http://keyboardclass.blogspot.com/


Top
#943539 - 11/16/08 05:34 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
Danny Niklas Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 905
Loc: Switzerland
 Quote:
Originally posted by Betty Patnude:
When you say: "The student doesn't have to be always the passive clueless recipient of someone else arbitrary instructions", are you saying there is a victim and a perpretrator involved?
[/b]

I'm saying "there could be".
My tense was hypothetical.
I wanted to elaborate on the fact that no one has ever claimed the student should tell the teacher what and how to teach. What has been claimed is that there can be collaboration between the students and teacher, so that many choices are made or discussed together. This would avoid the "hypothesis" of being a passive recipient of the teacher arbitrary instruction.

This has happened to me, this has happened to others. There are "teachers" of every flavour and you shouldn't feel belittled just because that is acknowledge. You is you, other teachers are other teachers.

You're lumping teacher together and getting personally offended by association. But being a teacher doesn't say much about someone's personality and humanity. Believe it or not there are very cruel, imcompetent, inhumane teachers out there. Like there are very cruel, inhumane, incompetent lawyers. Like there are vert cruel, incompetent, inhumane doctors. And so on. Your job doesn't say anytning about the person you are. You know for example that they found out a dentist who used to abuse his female patients while they were sedated for a teeth operation?
He also filmed them. A friend of my mother was literally killed in a clinic. She was beaten, tied and negated her medications for asthma. She suffucated while begging for water. Everyone knows what happened there, but it was impossible to find an unbiased coroner and an unbiased doctor, that would admit the sin of a collegue. They protect each other, just because the reputation of one might decrease the reputation of the whole category. This is sick and insane, in my opinion.

 Quote:
I'd like to think that we, as teachers, are more civilized than that.
[/b]

Some are and some aren't. Why do you want so strongly to lump everything into one category and make broad judgement about it? I had teachers who were not civilized at all. And I had teachers who were fantastic people with an extra-human kindness.

 Quote:
We're not supposed to warp them, and they are not supposed to allow themselves to be warped, and vice versa.
[/b]

But it happens. ("it happens" means that such scenario do happens, not that it happens in every teacher-student relationship) And so people here are entitled to talk hypothetically about how they envision a better teacher-student relationship. Why you take offense from this it's what I don't understand. You're Betty and you represent your teaching and your ethics. You don't represent all the teachers and the huge variety of competence, respect, humanity and even sanity there's among them.

 Quote:
Tell me again, please, how badly I misunderstand things. I can't wait to be told.
[/b]

You're taking it personally, that's your misunderstanding. People here are talking about a category which encompass every flavour of human behaviors (including abusive ones). That's why being a teacher is nothing but a label, it doesn't define anything else about the person.

Top
#943540 - 11/16/08 06:08 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11206
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
Can't people just be themselves at their piano lessons, no issues, no hidden agendas, no personality conflicts - having a good time collaborating together, getting some work done, empowering each other, enjoying a musical experience together.
That would be very nice indeed. In fact, that is how I see music lessons. It is how I have experienced music lessons.

The bottom line is trust. Trust of the teacher. And also trust of the student!

Top
#943541 - 11/16/08 10:49 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
Betty Patnude Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/11/07
Posts: 4896
Loc: Puyallup, Washington
Danny,

This is just too much information, and it seems to me that you post these kinds of things telling us how piano teachers and the world is to you. Are you not a young man who has seen about 2 decades of life so far? Why are you consumed with talking about the worst of situations and being the bearer of doom?

It's sad to me that this is your opinion through experiences you have had, and things that capture your attention, making drama of these things goes against my taste. It might be tolerable if it were an occasional happening, but to me, your perception is that you are in the know about "how the world turns", or maybe I should say "how the stomach turns". Diabolical. Negative to extremes. Focusing on the downside, too much explanations, too many details!

Danny said above: "This has happened to me, this has happened to others. There are "teachers" of every flavour and you shouldn't feel belittled just because that is acknowledge. You is you, other teachers are other teachers. You're lumping teacher together and getting personally offended by association. But being a teacher doesn't say much about someone's personality and humanity. Believe it or not there are very cruel, imcompetent, inhumane teachers out there. Like there are very cruel, inhumane, incompetent lawyers. Like there are vert cruel, incompetent, inhumane doctors. And so on. Your job doesn't say anytning about the person you are. You know for example that they found out a dentist who used to abuse his female patients while they were sedated for a teeth operation?
He also filmed them. A friend of my mother was literally killed in a clinic. She was beaten, tied and negated her medications for asthma. She suffucated while begging for water. Everyone knows what happened there, but it was impossible to find an unbiased coroner and an unbiased doctor, that would admit the sin of a collegue. They protect each other, just because the reputation of one might decrease the reputation of the whole category. This is sick and insane, in my opinion."

Danny, do you have students and teach music yourself? Has your education prepared you to teach piano? Do you talk in this authoritative voice in your private life, or is this your "writing style" speaking?

If you don't mind, I'll quote you one more time, as I feel the same way about what I've expressed in this posting: "This is sick and insane, in my opinion."

Enough of the "warp"!

What happened to the "creative exchange of ideas"? It can't exist in the nether world.

We are a composite of what we think, say, and subscribe to, personally and publically. We each have to find our own best way to "be" in this world. We reflect our "being" out into the world, and hopefully, it is for the betterment of both our inner world and the outer world of society.

That's all for now! Sermon over!

Betty Patnude

Top
#943542 - 11/16/08 11:35 AM Re: What happened creative exchange of ideas here?
Danny Niklas Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 905
Loc: Switzerland
I don't understand Betty, so I'm not sure what to reply. I just wrote an anecdote, a true fact which can be read on newspapers as well. I don't understand how that makes me negative. It is an important fact to me, because it, more than ever, taught me not to lump people together by their professional categories and also the reality of how people within the same category might protect each other in spite of what they did. My opinion is to judge every person and situation individually, and I can't understand why this is sad to you. I have shared a lot of positive experiences and encouraging words and I'm actually an optimistic person. Diabolic? I can't even watch horror movies! Getting sick to your stomach because of sad and unfair things that happens everyday to people is understandable, hiding the head in the sad and pretending they don't happen or feeling disturbed by someone mentioning them, is not. I post those "kind of things" when they're needed (or I think they are) and I post other kind of things, when other kind of things are needed. I'm not consumed with anything. I respect you Betty and it's unquestionable you love and respect your students (from the wise and tender words you have often used in describing your relationships with them) and I liked your last sentence - I really like people! I think friends are former strangers - because it's what I think too and I agree with.
But I'm politically incorrect and outspoken to the core, and come from a lower class life mentality and I'm afraid I will keep getting on your nerve, no matter what.

Top
Page 3 of 5 < 1 2 3 4 5 >

Moderator:  Ken Knapp 
What's Hot!!
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Interesting books about the piano, pianists, piano history, biographies, memoirs and more!
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
Download & Print Sheet Music Instantly
sheet music search
sheet music search

sheet music search
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
76 registered (AZNpiano, Alux, AtomicBond, Atrys, 15 invisible), 1142 Guests and 59 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
74318 Members
42 Forums
153721 Topics
2253476 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
New Topics - Multiple Forums
The Eagles - Hotel California (Piano Cover)
by Mr. Pianoman
04/25/14 03:29 AM
Student growing tall
by pianoplayer84
04/25/14 02:41 AM
Whole tone scales leading to interesting series of keys
by caters
04/25/14 12:16 AM
Another beginner
by mojoe
04/25/14 12:02 AM
GH1 tuning pin torque
by awyaks
04/24/14 11:38 PM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission