I am looking at buying my first piano. For about the same price i can purchase either a second hand Kawai or branch new Alex Steinbach Windsor. As far as a piece of furniture goes, I love the Steinbach. There have been mixed reviews on Steinbach, I'd like to be able to decifer between the sales pitch and reality. Anyone own a Steinbach and can provide feedback? Any professional input on the quality of the Steinbach? I am a piano novice. Thanks in advance for any advice.

Should have proof read my own entry - meant to put "brand new", not "branch new"

Alex Steinbach is a name that Samick uses for marketing pianos in Australia. Samick is a multi-line manufacturer and I don't know where Steinbach fits into their lineup.

Ron Overs occasionally posts here. He's a tech who manufactures/rebuilds pianos. I think that he used a Steinbach as the basis for one of his first pianos. His contact info in Sydney is 339 Concord Rd, Concord W, NSW 2138 Phone (local) 02 9736 2332, Fax (local) 02 9743 6563.

More info is available in kellytw's thread. Click this link.

(The envelope-shaped icon at the top of the post window is for sending PM's, if you want to use it.)

Thanks for your feedback. Will contact Ron. Anyone else have an opinion?

Libby, I edited my post, to include a link to a thread which has more info re Steinbachs.

Hi Libby,

I'll be interested to know how you go, as I'm in exactly the same boat. Currently looking at purchasing first piano and also a novice.

Still have a fair bit of looking, but so far in our price range the choices seem to be Yamaha T121, Alex Steinbach Romance (or Studio maybe), or Kawai K3.

The Melbourne piano showrooms certainly seem to favour the Steinbach's. I'd be interested to know how you go with contacting Ron Overs.

You mention mixed reviews on the Steinbachs - what have you heard?

Thanks and good luck with your purchase.

Balf

Did some web searching. Steinbachs appear to be simply re-badged Samicks. This opinion is based on their using laminated soundboards.(All soundboards are glued together in sections. For standard soundboards, think loaves of bread set side by side. For laminated soundboards, think layer cake.)

Laminated 'boards are associated with less expensive instruments. There's actually nothing wrong with that way of constructing 'boards. The problem is that the earliest ones were constructed out of cheap materials, such as plywood, rather than spruce. Del Fandrich, the designer of the Charles Walter grands, has posted that laminated 'boards may have greater tuning stability. Laminated 'boards are also less expensive to construct, because it's easier to get a good grain match when you can work with thinner slices.

Libby,[/b] your tech not liking to tune them probably results from their having overly tight tuning pins. That's a hassle for techs.

Hi Balf. I hope you have not purchased yet. I have been on an intense piano search that has a happy ending. Spoke to Ron, who was very helpful. Gave me some practical advice: go and actually play the pianos, which I did. Did not like the Kawai nor the Steinbach. Found a 1979 U1 Yamaha from The Piano Shop in Brisbane, run by a lovely, trustworthy couple, Alison and Jason Boyd. As soon as I played the Yamaha I knew it was what I was after. They also had a student Victor which was nice but thought I'd pay a bit extra for the Yamaha. Just for your info, the Yamaha T121, although say "Made in Japan" are actually made in China. It is the last bit that is assembled in Japan that allows them to put that badge on. I actually tried out a Yamaha U3 which, though taller than U1,sounded tubby in the bass. While I am a piano novice, my observation was vindicated by conversations I had with tuners who said that was a quirk of the U3. My piano buying experience has been an enlightening one. Respectfully, I found piano dealers to be less trustworthy than I would have expected. My advice is to go and actually play the piano. I am happy to chat to you over the phone and provide further insight if you like. I get my Yamaha this week and cannot wait. Good luck.

Thanks a lot Libby, no I haven't purchased yet. I'm actually off to a couple of shops tomorrow.

Funny you should mention the Yamaha U1, I saw a couple advertised at stores within my price range, but the ads didn't say how old, so I'll find that out tomorrow. I was considering whether this would be the way to go, buying a used U1 or U2, or even a U3E, as opposed to buying a new Steinbach or Kawai.

I'll let you know how I go tomorrow and congratulations on your purchase.

No, it's Taiwan. No, hang on, it's Indonesia.

At a guess, did a second hand dealer tell you that?

Greg

HI Balf
I have discovered a few things on my piano journey. One tech told me new is best, some techs only swear by second hand ones. As mentioned, it comes back to you and what you like, what your expectations are. Personally, I preferred the sound of the second Yamaha U1 and also liked the idea it had "soul", was not a brand new off the shelf instrument. As far as age goes, the serial number inside the piano will allow you to find out how old the piano is - in case the piano seller tells you some spiel that it doesn't really give you an indication. I have come to learn this is not true - the serial number will tell you the age. Bear in mind pianos are a bit like us. Apparently my 1979 is considered a teenager in piano years. Let me know how you go.

And Greg, I can't remember which person told me that. I have been inundated with a variety of different piano stories as of late.....I think the main point is that they are not made in Japan, as the seal leads you to believe.

Sorry, maybe I was being a bit too subtle. The T121 IS made in Japan. Second hand dealers have been saying it's not for years. They used to say "The T stands for Taiwan". Now they say it's made in China. The reason they say these things is obvious. The T121 is their competition. Before the T121 (then ET121) came along good second hand U1s were selling for around $5000- $6000. Now they're down to about $3000- $4000.

I'm sure this has been covered here before, but for some reason whenever I look it seems to pop up again.

Greg

Greg, thanks for bringing this up, as I was told by 2 piano dealers today (both who sell used U1's) that the T121 was made either in China or Indonesia (they didn't seem to know where), and they both said the same as Libby was told, that they get away with it by making some small part in Japan. I notice the Yamaha website says that it's made fully in Japan though.

Maybe I'll put the T121 back on my list

I visited 2 stores today as I said, and I think I've excluded the Steinbach. I've narrowed it down to either a new Kawai K3 which I really liked, or a used (20 - 25 yo grey market) U1 or U3. I think now I'll try find a new T121 to look at as well.

Balf

What does gray market mean?

There are lots of threads on the topic of grey market, but in short it refers to a piano that was originally made for and sold new in Japan and then exported from there as a used piano. I understand that most used U1's and U3's sold in stores in Australia are grey market. It's a huge industry. The T121 competes with this market as it's in the same price bracket. The used grey market pianos are not imported by Yamaha and so cut into their market - they find this not to their liking

Thanks. I had seen the term but never felt I got a succinct explanation. Yours makes sense. Ta.