I received my undergrad degree in piano last May. I've been thinking about grad school for awhile and am now convinced I'd like to get a master's in piano pedagogy (and possibly performance). I've done a little research and am rather surprised at how few places offer a masters in piano ped.

The reason I'd like to get a degree is so I'll have more credibility as a private teacher, and also that I'll know more what I'm doing. (This year has been full of trial and error.) I don't see myself teaching at college level - rather, I'd simply like to continue private lessons out of my own home to beginning and intermediate students.

What should I be looking for as I search for places to go? For those of you who have earned ped degrees, what are some of the things you wished you would have thought through in advance? What are some reasons you're glad you went through your masters? I'd like to keep most of my students as I go back to school. Is this a reasonable goal, or should I plan on becoming a full time student once again?

I have not done extensive research yet, but I've liked what I've heard about Urbana-Champeign in IL. Can anyone offer me their perspective on the school and its program?

Thanks!

Go to a program that has a strong community music school you can work in. I worked in the prep programs of LSU and Michigan during my graduate degrees, and they were great experiences.

I know the voice faculty in Champaign-Urbana and I liked them, but have no idea about their piano faculty. I'm sure they're very good. I was lucky enough to have a university nearby that offered a piano pedagogy degree (Univ of WI Stevens Point). It's a small music department, but I thoroughly enjoyed the faculty there. The most mazing experience of the whole thing was totally unexpected, but I took some composition classes and the comp professor there is top-notch, and introduced me to some wonderful people who changed my life as a musician. That in itself paid for the degree, but you never know what you will get out of something until it happens and you make the most of it. The best part of the degree itself, however, was the thesis. By writing that, I really solidified what was important to me as an educator and took my own teaching to a new level. I started to examine my teaching in a new way, and now I do it regularly to improve my techniques. It's not that I wasn't a good teacher before, but I don't think I was learning as much as my students were . I also liked the fact that it was a smaller music dept. so I got a lot of individual attention and got to know the faculty. This was very helpful because you get to pick their brains on things and really learn stuff that you might not get otherwise from just being in class.

I highly recommend it, but you have to be committed to getting it done, because there's no hand-holding to make sure you graduate. It's pretty easy to get all the classes done (I think I did them in 3 or 4 years part time), but the main thrust of work comes in getting that thesis done.

It might be interesting to note that one of the more successful local teachers went to college but never got her degree. She has tried to enter our teachers' association, which requires at least a BM or BA degree in music education or performance. When we tried to convince her to go back to school and finish what she had started, her exact words were, "I'm already a good teacher. Why should I get a degree that I absolutely do not need?"

She does have a point. If she can be an effective teacher, why does she have to take pedagogy classes or give a senior recital? A music degree does not a good teacher make.

That is true, AZN. I recall that when I was starting out teaching and completed my bachelor's, I had asked my teacher about getting a master's. She recommended that I teach privately for a couple of years first, because then I would get more out of a master's degree. I did teach for about a year or so before beginning, but during the whole process (which took me 7-8 years!) I learned a lot through the experience of teaching. I forgot about this until your story!

DoReMi, even if you begin your degree now, I would continue with your studio so you gain the hands-on experience that you just won't get anywhere else.

She does have a point. I would think it was more important for her to do continuous learning rather than get the piece of paper that shows she has a degree. I'm surprised she was not allowed membership in your association.

There is so much to read in pedagogy, it can be a lifetime pursuit for a piano teacher. I'd like to encourage teachers to read and read and read in pedagogy.

The tips alone from other teachers that have been written down and shared are alone worth reading although they might not be academically generated from a pedagogue, but from working teachers.

One year, in the early 1990's, I asked my students to make word lists that were about the language uses the kids were using at the time - like "grody to the max". Not that I needed to learn it for me to use it, I just wanted to know what they were really saying.

The pedagogy knowledge is much more important (IMO) than a method book. There are many important things that do not appear in method books and they need to be implemented in piano study.

Keep up with the piano teaching magazine subscriptions too. Keyboard Companion, Clavier, American Music Teacher.

Give yourself time in your daily or weekly schedule for reading on this subject. It's access to a whole new world if you haven't done it yet. You'll awaken your inner teacher!

Michigan State University in East Lansing has a great Piano Pedagogy Master's Degree with a very strong Community Music School to teach at.

The problem is that opportunities for students (such as festivals, competitions, theory exams, etc...) are usually only available to teachers who are members of a professional music teachers organization. When a teacher is a member the students are (in a sense) members.

Not sure about MTNA but in California's MTAC a teacher who doesn't have a degree in music can still join under under a point system. Points are given for various things including college music courses taken, workshops attended, number of years of lessons given, number of years of lessons taken past 11th grade, recitals given, degrees in something other than music, performance participation, etc... This is how I joined. Of course, everything has to be documented and that's the tough part, but it can be done. And if you don't have enough points to be an active member you may still qualify for provisional membership (where you work towards active membership).

Katie, being a piano teacher with a private studio demands knowledge/expertise in three areas. First is piano playing, which you already have. Second is developing teaching skills. This can be learned by trail and error, a rather slow process, or through self study or through a classroom program. As Betty suggests, becoming a voracious reader will help you immensely. So will the classroom program if you have the time available to take advantage of it.

The third is learning business skills. Yes, teaching is a business, and those with business skills, either self-taught or learned in class, will do better than those without. Should you decide to do a Master's program, make sure you can include some basic small business courses in it. You will be ever thankful.

John

Without further context, this doesn't sound
like a very good idea, in my view. What
often happens when a person leaves school
with a bachelor's degree and starts working
is that the daily 9 to 5 grind begins
to wear on him, and he'll start to miss
the more rarefied atmosphere of college.
Thus, the desire to return to college for
further study at the grad level, even though
the benefits of doing so are not that great.
If you are going to be teaching in your
home with mostly beginner and intermediate
students, then you have more than enough
education for that. And even if students
continue with you through high school,
you still should have enough credentials
to prepare them for an audition at any
college or conservatory.

One would need to be practical and weigh
the expense and disruption of income
vs. benefits of a masters. With
today's spiralling-out-of-control
tuition costs the benefits from a
masters don't seem to offset the price
of one.

OK,

So I'm looking at the homepage for the forums. I see that Gyro has commented last on the "masters degree" thread. I am imagining the nonsense that he will write....and then ...I see this.

I agree with his statement, especially from a business perspective.

Good insight Gyro.

Jeremy, our tax laws are quite different, for instance, so perhaps what we're able to do here, you cannot, or vice versa.

Also, it may be that you stumbled across an area where you can have 50 students, paying $80/hr. Most of us cannot, so we need an understanding of such mundane subjects as marketing.

John

John,

I'm confused.

I don't remember saying anything about $80 an hour. I don't make that much. (although if inflation keeps going this way)...

About marketing...Again, confused.

I was just agreeing with Gyro that a higher degree will not really help with earning potential. In my area there is no causation or even co-relation between degree level and rates (between Bmus and masters).

Again, that's just my area.

I generally agree with Gyro, and I think that's what happens in the real world. Everyone I know with a masters degree did so because they wanted to, not because of earning potential or because it was a necessary credential.

People like going to grad school because it furthers their education or because they're able to forge connections and be a part of an academic community.

As a long-term investment, though, I don't think a Masters degree is worthwhile. A doctorate can be, inasmuch as it really helps enable a career in higher education, but that's about it.

In the states, of course, this all changes if your degree is in music education and you teach in the public schools. Graduate degrees, and in some cases graduate hours, will get you a raise in pay. (Although with the "raises" you get in some school districts, it may take a few years to recoup the costs!)

The figures don't seem to add up. I'm understanding that you need to make at least a certain amount per month and that's the calculation. John, you seem to be saying that without being marketable (insufficient credentials) you would have too few students so you have to charge more to reach your needed earnings. But this is where the numbers don't seem to adds up.

50 students, if you teach 5 days a week = 10 hours/day - that can't be too few students. How could you handle more? You would be spending more than 10 hours/day since you also have various preparations to do, extra things outside of lessons. I'm almost sure something is misunderstood.

Gross earnings of 50 X $80/hour = $4000 per week = $16,000 per month. Do I understand that in the US you need to make $16,000 per month gross, or $192,000 gross annually to live comfortably?

If you're talking about half hour lessons, so that your 50 students occupy 5 hours per day and everything else is halved, and if I imagine a tax rate of 60% (???) then it makes some sense. Your 5 hours / day for 5 students would probably actually be 7 hours / day because of the extra things involved that don't happen during lesson time.

I'm a freelancer and a trained professional in two fields: translation and teaching. Both music teaching and translation are unregulated and anyone can practice them. I would put marketing second in reasons for qualifications. That piece of paper is supposed to mean that you have trained to do your job so that you can do it well. A translator should be an expert linguist as well as an expert translator, but not all receive the second training. A music teacher should be an expert in his craft and also know how to teach. This does go to marketability, because as a student I will look for someone who has the skills and I may or may not see that piece of paper as a sign that this teacher has those skills. It depends on whether the course does make someone a better teacher and how as a customer I see it.

I was bothered by Gyro's lumping together of beginners and intermediate students. It's my impression that beginners need experienced teachers because all the foundations of learning are being set up. An intermediate student is set up already, but is not so advanced as to be ahead of an inexperienced teacher. That's the folk wisdom I've heard which makes sense to me.

John, (anyone) for the small business course, have you actually found one that is decent? Our translators are also stumbling over that one. However, the course that I took was useless. It was modelled after big business selling for sale products, usually of a useless nature and in bulk, and advocated things like flyers with catchy titles and calculating bulk purchases and sales. For someone providing services for a specific need and providing quality, hardly anything fit. But there are definitely business skills such as bookkeeping, planning, time management, dealing with customers/students, taxes, health care (since the enterpreneur doesn't get that provided by an employer).

Keystring,

The most influential course I have ever taken (I've been in part-time studies for the last 10 years), has been Business Communications.

Everything I've learned has helped me to make more money, keep customers thrilled, and keep me happy. Communication is powerful.

Kriesler, I'd like to piggyback off your comment...
I've found that the process of the education is what creates the value. Networking, discussion, content and community. People can get this from many places, and a masters in pedagogy is a great place to get it. Those who have such a degree have a clear advantage, all things being equal, but still have to prove themselves.

I wanted to get a masters in pedagogy, but decided not to even try, as it would not increase my earning potential very drastically, and I'm not sure that I will be teaching full-time for the long haul.

I've instead been "diversifying my portfolio" so to speak. Over the last number of years, I have been attending university half-time to obtain a second (or primary...I will have a difficult decision to make in 2.5 years), professional designation in a completely different field. I will let you all know what it is when I achieve it.

Keystring,
I don't know of any courses, and they probably wouldn't be wroth the time, anyway. Being organized is key. If you are not organized, then it's worth the cost to hire someone who is to take care of things so that you can focus on what you're good at. My husband's business runs well because he doesn't have to spend time on the business end of things. He talks to clients and focuses on their projects, and he oversees the employees. He has a bookkeeper to take care of Accounts Receivable and Payable. Still, he is organized in what he does so he doesn't miss appointments with clients or deadlines.

So I guess to sum it up in a few words: 1)Know your craft 2)Know when to delegate to someone else (or turn away bad business) 3) Promise high and come in low (people will always be pleased if a job is finished earlier than promised, and always cheesed if it's late).

Jeremy,

My point was that private piano teachers are a small business. We're not employed, thus we have all of the support/behind the scenes work to do that schools have done by specialized support staff.

If she were to do a masters in pedagogy, she really ought to avail herself of some business classes to so she has some operating knowledge of how to run her business.

For example, I was talking with a teacher recently who plans to take a trip to Europe and visit a number of locations apropos piano and music. Is this trip tax deductible? If yes, what part of it? She plans to spend a week visiting distant relatives in Europe since she will already be there. How does this affect her deduction?

In the USA, we get socked with a 15% self-employment tax on top of what ever our marginal tax is (and if we have a spouse employed full time, it can and likely will be 25% or higher). Add on another 5% for state income tax. How should you plan your business operation to minimize the tax impact. You earn $100/mo from a student, you send $45 to the various tax authorities.

Knowing how to keep what you earn seems to me important - it contributes to the bottom line. If a couple of accounting and business courses along the way enhances this, then by all means take the additional course work.

By the way, there was an interesting news bit on the tv this morning. It seems that people earning a million dollars or more are in the habit of reading one or more business related non-fiction title a month. This supports Betty's advice to read, read, read!

I like your advice, John, we are always thinking about something piano, human brain and physical designs, learning and teaching, or business oriented. Then there's the music part!

I bet many of us read several books a month, copious magazine articles, watch lots of professional videos, to incredible research, and have a long "To Do" list and a long list of things to "Research".

Plus there is the interpersonal actions between us and our clients, students, and associates and public.

One would feel swamped with the load if it were not so satisfying and in our domain. We walk and talk who we are...and still, who we are to become in the future. No one is done yet, it's an ongoing thing from being alive as a private music teacher.

Yea, John! More power to people like us!

Betty

I see what you are saying now John,

I have taken numerous accounting, business, and marketing courses over the last few years...I guess I just took the knowledge for granted, as though it were clear to everyone.

15% Self employment tax? We don't have that here, unless one is incorporated, then standard double taxation applies.

You get to deduct mortgage interest, and we do not (well I do...but only for the percentage of my home that is used). But I guess that you would anyway becausue you are self employed, so there is no competitive advantage when compared to a normal working person.

How about a savvy accountant or bookkeeper, perhaps quarterly or available for advice for such questions as what might be a business expense? Our situations are not dissimilar in that respect. I have not found a course which was too useful, but the accountant that I must hire at least for doing taxes will point out things that can be expenses or investments that we would simply not think of. What kind of thing might a (future) piano teacher be looking for in terms of courses?

Jeremy, don't you have to pay double in CPP (pension plan) contributions, once as yourself and once as your employer "helping you contribute"? Is this provincial or federal?

I like your advice, John, we are always thinking about something piano, human brain and physical designs, learning and teaching, or business oriented. Then there's the music part!

I bet many of us read several books a month, copious magazine articles, watch lots of professional videos, to incredible research, and have a long "To Do" list and a long list of things to "Research".

Plus there is the interpersonal actions between us and our clients, students, and associates and public.

One would feel swamped with the load if it were not so satisfying and in our domain. We walk and talk who we are...and still, who we are to become in the future. No one is done yet, it's an ongoing thing from being alive as a private music teacher.

Yea, John! More power to people like us!

Betty

Accountants & book keepers are good, but they are not really in position to provide tax advice. A great deal of what I have learned has been through reading - books, magazines, etc. It has been invaluable.

For people to have as many resources as possible -- my father, who had a small business creating metal parts as a tool and die maker, received tax-related advice. I have also received advice from my accountant. A good accountant will have insights into all kinds of angles we don't think about. There are business expenses, depreciation, investments that we don't necessarily think about. This is in addition to informing yourself through reading, not instead of.

keystring, what I had in mind are tax specialists. Some are tax lawyers, and some are CPAs with tax specialties. The average book keeper wouldn't know nor keep up on the daily listings of tax rulings, either letter rulings or court decisions. There are many which affect musicians. For example, the average book keeper probably wouldn't know that there is an IRS ruling which allows teachers to deduct the full cost of foreign travel for educational enrichment. Just an example.

One would have to know what information to read, and where to find it, then. I suppose that small business course you mentioned might be a first foot in the door. I imagine that a lot of professionals are proud of their work and take every care, but not so on the business side of it - one can be a babe in the woods, though expert in every other way. Important points.

To the OP... If you love school go for it, but if you really want to teach then go for it... it is trial and error regardless and having a masters in pedagogy will not be the magic wand that will make you a great piano teacher or a piano teacher at all.

Also in regards to MTNA and its state branches, I don't think that you are required to have a degree in music to be a member, there should be alternative ways to become a member. Ask your state membership chair regarding this.