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Rubinstein...now we're talking! I have to get a recording of his preludes. He has often been referred to as greatest interpreter of Chopin, and I believe this to be true. I doubt if there is anyone in the world who doesn't know how I feel about him, by this time!

I'm sorry to learn that you are having confidence concerns, MaryRose. I think the only way to heighten your confidence is to remember that once you could play quite beautifully and your desire to do so...will make it happen again. That you are playing music which comes easier to you will also add to your self-assurance. Every journey begins with one step, and you are taking those steps toward your goal. But please set those goals realistically, at least for now.

You are so intelligent, MaryRose. Maybe that is part of the problem, as you see it. I think people who are very smart unconsicously make great demands upon themselves and are more likely to get discouraged when they don't perform the way they believe they should. This is a NOT meant to be insulting, MaryRose, I hope you know that. I just hate to think that you are unhappy and frustrated. Your recital piece was so lovely. Anyone who can play as you do, can play anything...given time and practice. You already have the ability!

As far as your belief that you can't play Chopin the way you think he should be played...gosh. Now I KNOW you are too hard on yourself. If this were true, MaryRose, I would have no business playing him. I'm sure he would shutter if he could hear me play. But what is so wonderful about his music is that there are so many intricate ways that one can play it. It is open to many nuances and rubato. As far a "zal," I don't think it's just a Polish feeling. There is no ethnic group in this world that hasn't experienced this emotion. For the history of every nation has sufferred in some way... war, rebellions, plague, drought, crop failure...and on and on.

I agree that we are indeed so fortunate to be able to listen to music we love. I know I wouldn't be able to play anything if I couldn't "hear" it first.

Everything you want to be, you already are. You just have to bring it "out."

Deepest regards.
Kathleen

Kathleen, thanks for your kind words! You are very encouraging. You know, I came to Chopin's music entirely through the printed page. I can still remember that day at the beginning of the school holidays when I first read through the music of a Chopin piece - my favourite mazurka, 63/3 no less - and although I didn't do very well with it, and had never heard a recording, I was comletely captured by the wonderful melody and counterpoint. It went straight to my heart. And that was me enraptured by Chopin, from that day to this!

I wonder if other forumites would share with us what was the very first piece of Chopin's music that alerted them to the fact that here was something so very special?

Some concerts of Chopin's music to download:

Berezovsky

Berezovsky again

Evgeny Kissin

My first Chopin piece .. Valse Op.69 no.2 (that was like 4 years ago)

I loved it! Made me want to discover Chopin even more.

hey maryrose, any info about your strange links? What do you mean by concerts (the concertos??) or is it live concerts? Program?

Bassio - 69/2 is one of my favourite waltzes. It is so wistful and elegant.

The "strange links" are recordings of concerts. They aren't CDs as such. Someone just told me about them; I'm afraid I know no more than that

Thanks

I think I was about 8 or 9 when I first heard the 10/12. When I learned he was a Pole and that he wrote it when he was 19, perhaps in rage for what was becoming of his homeland, the whole "package" just all came together for me. I loved him as a person before I really had heard very much of his music. But that soon changed.

Kathleen

I'm sure many of you have read the post by Frycek. We can't let this happen without a fight.

Whatever the reason may be, let's hope it's one that will soon resolve itself, and we can celebrate the wonderful day when Frycek returns to us. I hope it's not too long.

This thread would be about 1/3 its size if it weren't for Frycek. I may be a big mouth, but most of what I say is not in keeping with the true intent of this thread. So please, Fycek, come back soon. Or even better, don't leave at all!

Kathleen

Kathleen,

We're "mourning" the loss of Frycek. He's upset about something, or going through a change, or dissatisfied with the quality of the discussion. I think he will check back from time to time, but his knowledge of history will be missed :-(

Please keep us updated on #17! I love that piece, reminds me of all the fun outings my uncle took us one when we were little. Tranquil, yet purposeful. A beautiful piece! The "Castle" may in fact have been a Cathedral.

I must say how much I enjoy reading your postings, and confess that you've helped rekindle my love for the genius that is Chopin. I also think you are too hard on yourself sometimes, and underestimate your own potential.

Dear Gerg: Thank you for your kind words. I believe Frycek will be back fairly soon.

I most definitely will keep you posted on my progress on the 17th prelude. Yikes, that first page. Once I get through that one, I think the worst is over although I haven't had to nerve to look at the other pages yet!

As I mentioned before, both hands are playing in the same octave much of the time, which means hands under or hands over or fingers from the LH crossing over/under fingers of the RH. I can't say it's difficult to play, yet. Just figuring out the chords and the fingering.

Eleanor Bailie (the author of the Graded Book on Chopin) gives 3 pages to how to play it. But, all in terms of technique and much description as to how certain passages should "sound." This is all well and good, but before one can worry about how it should sound, but has to figure out the complexities of its simple dymanics. The book is great, don't get me wrong. But I wish she made some suggestions on fingering and methods to get the hands working correctly to keep them from cramping up.

Regards,
Kathleen

I just ordered the Baillie book (50 bucks! ouch!). But as you say, Kathleen, it's cheaper than private lessons ...

I really don't remember when I first heard Chopin's music. I'm an overeducated (nonpianist) conservatory survivor, so of course I was taught to "appreciate" it. An older sister and I both hobbled through a few preludes and waltzes, very badly, way back when. I guess I've really appreciated it in the past year, since I've learned a few of his pieces at a much higher level and have experienced firsthand how well they lie on the piano and what a great means of expression they are for the pianist.

So glad you ordered the book, PianoAgain. I paid over $50 for a book written by some famous (?) pianist last year, and it was so boring that I couldn't get past the first chapter. AND it was about 50 pages long.

You will definitely be getting your money's worth. Mine looks like it's gone through a major war already. It's never far from my side, no matter where I am. It's just great reading.

I took it with me recently when I had to go to the doctor. While in the waiting room, I had my nose buried in it and didn't notice an older (well, older than me, if you can believe it) woman standing in front of me, gazing at the title. When I looked up, she asked if I was a professor of classical piano. I was really tempted to say: "Yes, of course." But I was too afraid she'd ask me some question that I couldn't answer (and of course, there are a few thousand of those).

Kathleen

Kathleen,

Does Bailie mention this possibility?: Break the tasks into two:

1. Chords: First get the chords - just hold them until the next chord change. Don't play the repetitions of the chords or worry about dynamics of the repeated chords just yet. Teach your fingers the transitions.

2. Rhythm/Touch: Once you have all the chord transitions for a given section (nominally I'm thinking three distinct sections for this piece, with major similarities between section A and section C) then add each chord repetition and start working on your dynamics. This is where you add the touch that marks the transition from simply playing notes to something magical.

Personally I'd recommond both HS and HT practice.
This way, you can focus on these two key elements, esp. important in this piece, separately and end up with a beautiful performance.

Just a suggestion. I cannot wait to hear it!

EDIT: FWIW I've knocked out #18 and #23 recently, and I'm nothing special. #18 is essentially a "showoff" dynamo piece with a hellish arpeggiac run near the middle, and my little digital keyboard can barely handle it (the whole keyboard shakes at the violent octave jumps at the end), and #23 is similar to #17 but more whimsical and lacking #17's depth. It would be really, really neat if PW members could each pick a Prelude and have a Chopin Prelude concert, of all 24.

Hi Gerg:

Thank you so much for your great advice. Yes, Bailie does stress tackling the chords first, but not playing them singling, as you did. I like your idea very much. She stresses not taking the fingers off the chords so that a smooth legato is eventually accomplished. This I have been trying and am making some progress. I'm determined to memorized that first page, so that I can concentrate on the dynamics. I so love this piece; it will be a labor of love (for a long time).

We would love to hear you play the #18 and 23. Do you have recording capabilities?

Yes, it would be OUTSTANDING to have an all prelude Chopin concert! I bet we could get some of the members of the Pianist's Corner to join in. Some of them probably know all 24!

Thanks again... I am definitely going to try out your suggestion.

Regards,
Kathleen

One of my friends at school, a fantastic pianist, played all 24 preludes for his senior recital. It was note-perfect except for a brief stumble in #4 (I suspect he probably didn't practice that one much). I wish I'd asked him for a copy of the recording.

A PW Chopin prelude recital is a great idea.

I was looking at my copy of #17 last night, BTW, and remembered that I analyzed some of it for a class I took. The chord structure and harmonic changes are extremely complicated, which may be why it's more difficult than some.

Hi, ya'll, again. Now I'm begging your pardons for the unease and confusion my recent lapse in judgement caused so many of you. Several of you were kind enough to send me pm's that I was just too chargrined to answer. All the concern was appreciated. Next time I have the impulse to go to earth I promise I won't do it so publicly since I caused so much trouble and now that I know myself a little better I know I'll be back. So many of you wondered what was wrong. Nothing specific, nothing that isn't the status quo with me 24/7. It's just that at some times that status quo becomes more burdensome than at others and there are times when I'm a bit more manic/depressive than at others. And there are times when I'd just as soon find some abandoned moonshiner's cabin and hold up for awhile, just me and my thoughts. So if I should make myself scarce just imagine me out in the piney woods with the hoot owls and the moon shining overhead.
Joe

Frycek:

I don't know you as well as many others on the forums, but I sure am glad that you have reconsidered and the mist has cleared from your view.

Frycek, sounds pretty normal to me, glad to have you back.

Now, I am starting Chopin's Nocturne in F minor Op. 55/1. Is there a cliff notes for this thread, or must I read all 52 pages of it?

=)

Naught: Here is a link to the index I almost finished on the Study Group for the 55.1. I think you will find some information here that should be helpful.

Index on topics for the 55.1 nocturne

However, please do write us and ask any other questions you might have. Many of us have completed the nocturne. Im trying to remember now. Nancy333, Ragnhild, Sarah, LisztAddict and Peyton. (Hope I didn't leave anyone out.) I completed 3/4 of it...just could NOT get that last page and didn't want to spend any more time on it. Any questions about fingering, or whatever...please do ask.

Eleanor Bailie in her book devoted four full pages to it. I am going to try to scan them and will post them on this site. I'll probably be arrested for doing this, but I love to live dangerously.

Check back later and I hope to have the pages ready. Good luck. I happened to love this nocture, maybe because I could actually play it (all but that last page). It has a certain dignity and elegance. It is sometimes referred to as the "poor man's version of the 48.1." because it has a similiar sense of "organic unity" (whatever the heck that is)...Bailie's words.

Kathleen

It's replies like yours Kathleen, that make this forum great. What a wealth of information. Thank you so much. And to everyone who contributed all that knowledge.

*starts reading*