Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Teachers Forum Please advice. Should we change teacher?

Our almost-7-yr-old starts piano lesson recently. His first teacher has two state-award-winning students, but she was so strict that our child started hating piano very fast. So we had a new teacher after only a month.
The new teacher was great with kids. Now, he began to like music again and practicing is no longer a struggle. HOWEVER, unlike the first teacher, we noticed this teacher didn’t teach anything about fingers.
We arrived a little early yesterday and saw an older student play. She was playing a quite complex piece, but her whole hands were totally flat on the keys! And the fingers never leave the keys, they just moved from one key to another horizontally. This is totally wrong according to the first teacher, yet the current teacher said nothing.
We only want our kid to love music and don’t expect him to participant in any competitions, but still, is it ok to play piano like that? We are clueless parents, would really appreciate you teachers give your opinion. Should we start to look for a new teacher again?

Hello! And welcome. Since you're up in Seattle (at least from Olympia) I thought I'd start off with a solid "It depends."

Seriously, the teacher may have a different order to teach the various aspects of pianism, although I personally work with hand position right off the bat, I don't make a big deal of it while the student is trying to master so many other details at the same time. Have you asked about it?

As you are in Seattle, if you decide to switch once again, you might call Jennifer Bowman over at Sherman-Clay and ask her for a listing of the "Well Prepared Pianist Institute" teachers in Seattle. These teachers are working with students to develop musical playing in the style of Leon Fleischer, Rubenstein, and the past grand masters of piano.

Disclaimer. I am one of those teachers, but am located too far for you!

Sometimes a student plays a certain way even after the teacher tells them not to. You dont' know how long this student has been with this teacher. PErhaps they jsut transferred, and the teacher is working with them on fixing some incorrect technique. There are also differing schools of thought on how to play. Are you expecting to see fingers lifted off the keys? There is a school of technique that teaches and very close-to-the-keys playing. Or there might be an arch around the knuckles and the rest of the fingers are flat (but the tips touchign the keys). It's really hard to assess it without seeing it myself. How did this student sound? That is what this whole piano-playing is about, and there has to be some leeway for differing techniques, all else being equal.
I recommend talking to this teacher. Call her up and share your concerns. Find out her philosophy on techinque. If you don't agree with hers, or if she doens't teach technique, then you have to consdier what's best for your son. He's enjoying music now, and he wasn't before.

Dear Parents:

Handshape is something that is usually developed from the first lesson, but it's possible your young man has trouble holding the shape, is double jointed and the fingers cave in from pressure, or he holds the hand and wrist rigidly, so perhaps the teacher is letting him play in his own natural way, rather than making the hand shape an issue at the moment. The teacher may be observing and noting the "problem" but choosing to do nothing about it for a while. This would release the child from becoming inhibited by having to make and hole "perfect" hand shapes when he truly can not yet do that.

As far as fingering, surely he knows his right hand and left hand, and the finger numbers counting from the thumb, as 1-2-3-4-5 (fingers are numbered in contrary order with pinkies being 5). Do you have the assignment notebook to look at and see what is entered there as far as instruction, and in the music lesson materials?

The girl you saw and heard may have been using a technique with flatter fingers for romantic music with predominately black notes and octaves, making it look like her hands were crawling note to note. I'm not sure what you were saying about her.

If you are not pianists, please don't second guess, ask an outright question of the new teacher but in a considerate way and expecting that he will provide an understandable answer.

It is so good to hear that they like each other, and your son is practicing again. That is valuable. If you were to change teachers abruptly again without resolving the problem satisfactorily, you are in danger of becoming a "teacher hopper". (No insult intended.) I don't know how your son would interpret that, but it might be perplexing to him as to why you are changing teachers. He may feel he is not pleasing you or the teachers, and place blame on himself. What do you think would be his reaction?

He is young yet, and he needs the basic information well grounded, and for the enjoyment level to be up high enough. He is on an adventure of self discovery, I would imagine. When he grows to a larger hand, all things technical and music making should have been presented and learned.

You have asked about the experience of the 2nd teacher, have you not? Learn what he is all about first before deciding. Give this young man your sincere support and praise for the things that you see going well. And, let the teacher teach. By all means go to the studio recitals and see firsthand how all the students are doing.

This advice comes from my experience in teaching and it is from my philosophy about the student - parent - teacher - relationship and all cooperative efforts in behalf of all the participants. Everyone should be building a bridge of clear communication.

Best wishes! You won't be clueless parents for long!

Betty Patnude

Thanks all for replying, we will talk to the teacher.

if the teacher's students play with flat hands, switch teachers. I played with flat fingers for a really long time and it took forever for my teacher to correct that problem. My guess is that you son did not hate piano when he was with the 1st teacher, it is the disipline and practise that he hates, I know because I had a student like that.

or you could find out more about the teacher and whether the flat hands issue is something the teacher does'nt care about, if the teacher does'nt care ...Switch!

Thanks, Amelia. That's what I was worrying about. I wonder how you handle your "trouble" student.

im sorry to say it, but i ended up dropping her, because she started to show too much rebellion and her parents don't support me as the teacher, her mom just kept on trying to manupilate me

There is no perfect teacher. Maybe she's great musically. Maybe she can inspire your son to practice. You can at least keep her while you search for another teacher.

I once had a teacher who hardly ever taught anything about technique. I didn't care for him but others raved about him and he had some good students. My opinion was that his good students had had good basic training before they got to him.....

I dunno---I really think the hand position is pretty important to start off correctly.....imho

karen, I don't disagree with anything you've said, but I've learned recently (although I think I knew it before, so "relearned" would be more accurate) that correct use of the hands is pretty much a life-time study.

Yes, John I agree...that' why I kind of hemmed and hawed about it. It's hard to argue with success...

Wow! In my view this quote perfectly describes Vladimir Horowitz’s style of playing. I know some people who believed that his hands position was “wrong”. I also know people who tried hard to imitate his style of playing. No doubts, it served him rather well!

There are as many different hands accommodation styles as there are piano players.

As the matter of fact there are pieces where this is the ONLY way one can perform. The good example would be Chopin Etude in A Flat Major, op 25 No. 1. Just to play this piece you have to stretch your fingers flat and move them around without leaving the keyboard.

So, the new teacher is great with kids and now, the student began to like music again and practicing is no longer a struggle. And you want to leave the teacher just because some other one teaches another hand position?! Sorry, but it does not seem rational to me.

I agree with Balalaika. I play both op 25 no 1 and the Black Note with flat hands/fingers. Contemporary witnesses said Chopin and his pupils did the same.

Sadly today there are still flat finger schools vs curved finger schools - and neither meet. Talk to the teacher, or better yet watch a lesson or two.

the Black Key etude shouldn't be played with flat hands even if you have small hands. I have small hands and I curve my fingers.

Amelialw, why ever not?

the point of the Black Key Etude is to train the flexability of your fingers and make your fingers strong even when you play with curve fingers and in order to give the shape to the piece that's what you have to do

Amelialw, isn't that the point of all etudes?

It is really easy to pick a few selected pieces, that require the hands to play flat-fingered. Horowitz is the obvious exception to many rules, and no one can argue with the outcome. BUT...just as he is the exception along with the black-key etude, it would be imprudent to imply that exceptions dictate the rule. If you were to watch a hundred concert pianists, I would bet that 99 play with curved fingers most of the time. I often watch Classic Arts Showcase. I have yet to see any pianists that played flat fingered as a rule. It is very difficult to transfer weight from the body to the keys with flat fingers. The fingers cannot do it alone. Horowitz, along with an amazing instrument made more sound than any other pianist of memory. Be assured he was transferring weight for those BIG sounds. His finger position was in a perpetual state of change. I teach the kiddos to curve their fingers. Most kids from age 7 can get their fingers around a tennis ball. This is a great shape for any young pianist. Kiddos however and especially early on are not the most coordinated. After 6 months, I would like to see a valiant effort at achieving this hand position.
John Pels

Quite a lot of Chopin cries out for flat fingers. With flat fingers you are strengthening the lumbricals which otherwise are weak. Also they are the most responsive muscles (before anyone disagrees could they check out Schultz first?).

John, why shape their hands at all?