Same song played twice at recital?

Posted by: Gisele

Same song played twice at recital? - 04/24/13 10:27 PM

Oh no....Upon review of my students' recital pieces tonight, I realized that 2 of my students chose the same piece. And unfortunately, both have had their lessons this week already and do not have a backup piece.
Has anyone ever had 2 students play the same piece at a recital?

Gisele
Posted by: malkin

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/24/13 10:58 PM

It happened one year when my daughter played violin. The teacher asked each of the kids if it would bother them, and neither of them had a problem with it. They were not back to back in the program.

No big deal.
Posted by: Polyphonist

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/24/13 10:58 PM

Originally Posted By: Gisele
Oh no....Upon review of my students' recital pieces tonight, I realized that 2 of my students chose the same piece. And unfortunately, both have had their lessons this week already and do not have a backup piece.
Has anyone ever had 2 students play the same piece at a recital?

Gisele

The only problem with this is that the audience will compare the renditions, and the student who doesn't play as well will feel embarrassed and jealous.
Posted by: Piano*Dad

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/24/13 11:04 PM

That's a worst case scenario, not a necessary outcome. To me, it's more worrisome if the students are a bit more advanced than if they are really young.

Are the students friends?
Posted by: Polyphonist

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/24/13 11:08 PM

Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
That's a worst case scenario...

...which is the one that should always be assumed.
Posted by: Barb860

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/24/13 11:14 PM

Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
That's a worst case scenario, not a necessary outcome. To me, it's more worrisome if the students are a bit more advanced than if they are really young.

Are the students friends?


I have 2 students playing the same piece (very newbie beginner students) this week in a recital and I'm not concerned, it will be fine. However, I have 2 other students who are also playing the same piece and they are friends and a bit competitive. In that situation, I put them in separate recitals.
Posted by: Peter K. Mose

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 12:05 AM

I'm sure those students could flip a coin and the loser could play another selection. Certainly they must each have another finished piece after a year of study. I think it's a bad idea to have two students playing the same composition.(Unless they are young kids playing dorky 8-bar rote pieces that they both play well.)
Posted by: Polyphonist

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 02:29 AM

Originally Posted By: Gisele
And unfortunately, both have had their lessons this week already and do not have a backup piece.


Originally Posted By: Peter K. Mose
I'm sure those students could flip a coin and the loser could play another selection.


Ahem...
Posted by: Nikolas

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 02:51 AM

Originally Posted By: Polyphonist
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
That's a worst case scenario...

...which is the one that should always be assumed.
Not really... Unless one loves negative outcomes! grin (not aimed at you, just in case... a light joke)...

It's happened to many teachers I know here in Greece and it's not a huge deal really. I mean especially during Xmas, everyone goes for the well know works, so it's bound to happen. No biggie.

just let them know, or have a 'practice session' with them, in order for them to really understand they have the same piece and to get used to the idea. And of course don't have them back to back...
Posted by: AZNpiano

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 05:01 AM

Originally Posted By: malkin
It happened one year when my daughter played violin.

This happens quite frequently in Suzuki studios, since the repertoire is severely limited.
Posted by: Piano*Dad

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 08:10 AM

Originally Posted By: Polyphonist
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
That's a worst case scenario...

...which is the one that should always be assumed.


I presume you never drive a car ... wink
Posted by: Polyphonist

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 08:42 AM

Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
Originally Posted By: Polyphonist
Originally Posted By: Piano*Dad
That's a worst case scenario...

...which is the one that should always be assumed.


I presume you never drive a car ... wink

ha
Posted by: Marit

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 08:52 AM

I once played the same piece as someone else in a recital. I was co-hosting, and of course I ended up having to announce the guy who was playing the same piece... I jokingly told the audience that I'd hand out pieces of paper, and they could compare, and by the end of the evening we'd pick a winner.

...And had a huge black-out which lasted the majority of the piece.
Posted by: Peter K. Mose

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 09:22 AM

There's always a back-up piece to play, even if a teacher thinks otherwise.
Posted by: Minniemay

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 09:40 AM

It's not a big deal. Separate them in the program.

One of my mentors studied with Carl Friedburg in New York. One one occasion he heard a Bach Toccata being played in the practice room by another student of Mr. Friedburg's. The two of them played for each other. When my mentor went to his next lesson, he said, "Mr. Friedburg, Susan is also playing this piece and she plays it quite differently!" Mr. Friedburg's reply: "I know! Isnt' that wonderful?"
Posted by: Morodiene

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 09:58 AM

If it can be avoided and another student has something else they can do, I would ask them what they'd like to do. Let the students decide what they're OK with. Be sure to have them play a different parts of the recital so as to avoid too much comparison.

Or if they both have another piece they could do, have them both do that and one can play the RH for the piece in common while the other plays the LH as a duet!
Posted by: chasingrainbows

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 11:18 AM

During the holidays, it's difficult to avoid, especially since I often have beginning students on the same level. However, at my upcoming recital, two students will be playing the same piece (although they will also play another additional, different piece as well). The reason -- they love the piece, and play it very well. If one student was not playing the piece as well as the other, I would substitute. I think it's important for me to plan my recital program at least a month in advance to avoid repetitive pieces at my recitals.
Posted by: Overexposed

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 11:32 AM

Originally Posted By: Minniemay
It's not a big deal. Separate them in the program.

One of my mentors studied with Carl Friedburg in New York. One one occasion he heard a Bach Toccata being played in the practice room by another student of Mr. Friedburg's. The two of them played for each other. When my mentor went to his next lesson, he said, "Mr. Friedburg, Susan is also playing this piece and she plays it quite differently!" Mr. Friedburg's reply: "I know! Isnt' that wonderful?"



Posted by: MrsLois

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 11:35 AM

I wouldn't worry about it. Last year, in my recital of 46 kids, I had 7 kids play the same piece. It's not a big deal.

If that's what will get them up there playing confidently in front of people, who cares?
Posted by: Overexposed

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 12:40 PM

My last recital I, too, accidentally scheduled 2 kids to play the same piece. I realized it a couple of weeks prior to the recital. The 6 year old wanted to keep the piece. I then let the 8 year old know that a 6 year old would be playing the same piece, and he gladly picked a different one. smile
Posted by: Bluoh

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 01:29 PM

Personally, I think it's fine, if the students are fine with it. It's not ideal, but you can space them farther apart if neither of them can switch pieces. After all, they've worked hard and it's not exactly fair to ask either of them to switch on (short?) notice. smile
Posted by: Gisele

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 01:53 PM

Thankfully, these 2 kids don't know each other. I was thinking of asking one to replace that song, but she has worked so hard on it (as has the other student). As suggested, I will have to place them as far apart as possible. Lesson learned: when list of recital pieces is long, put them in excel format weeks before the date and sort them by title.....
Posted by: Bluoh

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 01:57 PM

Originally Posted By: Gisele
Thankfully, these 2 kids don't know each other.

That's good. You'd hate to create rivalry in the studio. Live, learn, and let live. wink
Posted by: Barb860

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 02:47 PM

Originally Posted By: MrsLois
I wouldn't worry about it. Last year, in my recital of 46 kids, I had 7 kids play the same piece. It's not a big deal.

If that's what will get them up there playing confidently in front of people, who cares?


thumb
Posted by: AZNpiano

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 04:23 PM

I don't like assigning the same pieces to different students, unless they are still in method books. Once the student is out of method books, I make a point to teach different materials to different students. Several reasons:

1) The music won't stagnate.

2) I get to cater the repertoire to the student's individual taste and needs.

3) I get to expand my own repertoire.

4) Students get exposed to as many different pieces as possible, from what they play, to what they hear at recitals.

5) Students won't end up comparing themselves.

When you send as many students to competitions and festivals as I do, you will run into repeated repertoire all the time. Bach Festival is notorious for having seven kids in a row play Invention No. 8. So, within the confines of my own studio, I avoid repeated repertoire at all cost.
Posted by: kck

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 10:19 PM

Oh this happens at my kid's recitals on a fairly regular basis. Especially with beginner kids. They just break up the kids. One plays towards the beginning and one towards the end. It's never a big deal.
Posted by: Polyphonist

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 10:26 PM

Originally Posted By: kck
Oh this happens at my kid's recitals on a fairly regular basis. Especially with beginner kids. They just break up the kids. One plays towards the beginning and one towards the end. It's never a big deal.

This method seems to be advocated by many on this thread, but it is a problem if you are trying to arrange the participants in order of increasing proficiency, ie the beginners first, and the advanced students (if there are any) at the end (which is the way many teachers do it). Thus, to put a student playing a Bach invention between two Liszt Transcendentals is not really what you're looking for in this case, but that's what would happen if you tried to put them at the opposite end of the recital from the other student playing it. I think it's much better just to avoid assigning the same piece to both students.
Posted by: Minniemay

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 10:54 PM

I never put students in order of proficiency, so it's not a problem for me.
Posted by: Polyphonist

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 10:55 PM

Originally Posted By: Minniemay
I never put students in order of proficiency, so it's not a problem for me.

How do you order them? Alphabetically? grin
Posted by: Minniemay

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 10:56 PM

I group pieces around a theme or vary them by mood or historical interest. There are many ways to do it.
Posted by: Polyphonist

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/25/13 10:59 PM

Originally Posted By: Minniemay
I group pieces around a theme or vary them by mood or historical interest. There are many ways to do it.

I see.
Posted by: Morodiene

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/26/13 07:12 AM

You could do chronologically according to the composer's time period. I've never done that, but I think it would be cool. Or you can do according to the tempo of the piece, alternating fast and slow (I do this often).

I used to do according to difficulty of the piece ending with the most advanced students, but I think it's obvious who is the most advanced, and who cares? Now I like it more with what sounds good. I will, however, put students who get stage fright in a spot where they prefer (some want to be first, some want to be close to the beginning but not first, etc.).
Posted by: piano2

Re: Same song played twice at recital? - 04/26/13 08:16 AM

I definitely don't programme in order of difficulty. Older beginners wouldn't appreciate being grouped with the 4-6 year olds.
I get great joy out of making as interesting a programme I can with the pieces available. I mix the levels throughout, for the listening enjoyment of the audience. I make sure the smallest kids are closer to the beginning because I know it's hard to wait your turn. The first performer must be really well prepared, know how to bow properly, and know how to behave during a performance - this child is setting the tone for the whole recital, so you have to choose wisely.

There is also the bench height and footstool to take into considersation (if you use an adjustable bench and footstool). I use both of those and usually put 3 or 4 similarly sized students back-to-back in the programme. This decreases the number of adjustments I need to make during the concert.
I also intersperse duets throughout the programme, so that there is lots of variety for the audience.

You also have to consider the feelings of the students performing. Even though we don't want them to, students and families compare performances. For that reason, I never put siblings back to back, or other students that tend to compete.

I probably spend too much time on my programmes, but I do enjoy the time spent, and feel that the results are enjoyable and interesting concerts.