Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site

Posted by: Possum SP280Krome

Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 11:20 AM

http://europe.yamaha.com/en/products/mus...105/?mode=model

Contains clearer audio than the NAMM one.
It does sound a little more "pronunced" than the P95

Couldnt find a manaual; would be curious if it is a 4 layer sample.

Specs say Pure CF sampling- BUT wouldn't a P95 be off of a CFIII as well?

Has an additional speaker on each side than the P95.
Don't care about the accompiament feautres
Posted by: BaR

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 11:45 AM

Would have to play one in person. Without the MIDI din connectors, it doesn't seem like a good trade-off over the P95 for me, even though the resonance and line outs are very tempting.
Posted by: bsl100

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 12:07 PM

I just posted on another thread about the UK Yamaha website showing details of the P-105.

The Pure CFIIIS sampling does not mention the number of layers. And it's strange that Yamaha does not mention this. Maybe it's the same number of layers as the P-95. I'd be surprised if it's 4 layers like the higher priced P-155.

There are now 4 round speakers and the output has gone up to 14W. I'm sure the sound from the speakers will be better than the earlier P-95.

The additional line level outputs could make the P-105 a good cheaper and lighter alternative as a stage piano (provided you are comfortable with GHS keys).
Posted by: Possum SP280Krome

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 12:43 PM

Originally Posted By: bsl100
I just posted on another thread about the UK Yamaha website showing details of the P-105.

The Pure CFIIIS sampling does not mention the number of layers. And it's strange that Yamaha does not mention this. Maybe it's the same number of layers as the P-95. I'd be surprised if it's 4 layers like the higher priced P-155.

There are now 4 round speakers and the output has gone up to 14W. I'm sure the sound from the speakers will be better than the earlier P-95.



I agree- it seems odd that they don't mention the layers which lead me to believe they are just picking one. I hope to be able to try one out soon and post a review as well as my decision whether or not to upgrade
The speakers and the ability to line out though is a major plus.
Posted by: bsl100

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 01:16 PM

Doesn't the P-95 have 3 layer sample. If so, the P-105 would have at least 3 layer sample. The P-155 has 4 layer sampling. This is the difference in their CVP 501 and CVP 503 clavinovas.

The P-95 would have 3 layers as it mentions different sound samples at different velocities of key strike.
Posted by: MacMacMac

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 01:20 PM

I think that if they don't mention layers you can expect just one layer.
Posted by: maurus

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 01:33 PM

P95 has just one layer, so I'd expect the P105 to be the same.
Posted by: Possum SP280Krome

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 02:28 PM

Agreed. Seems to be a general consensus. It reduces the temptation to upgrade a P95 which in reality is only 2010 for a 105.
Posted by: bsl100

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 03:19 PM

The CP33 has dynamic stereo sampling and they don't mention any layers. But if I understand correctly, it has 3 layers.
Posted by: anotherscott

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 05:24 PM

Originally Posted By: bsl100
The CP33 has dynamic stereo sampling and they don't mention any layers. But if I understand correctly, it has 3 layers.

Yes, the CP33 manual says 3 layers. I'm not sure but I think the CP300 and P155 may be four.
Posted by: bsl100

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 10:36 PM

Anotherscott, both the CP33 and CP300 have 3 stage dynamic AWM sampling. Both mention string resonance. Did this show up in the DPBSD project?

Also you have sent the P95 sample in the above project. Was it 1 layer or 3 layers?
Posted by: anotherscott

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/03/12 10:49 PM

Originally Posted By: bsl100
Anotherscott, both the CP33 and CP300 have 3 stage dynamic AWM sampling.

Correct, thanks. I remember there being *some* spec difference between the CP300 and P155, but don't remember off-hand what it was; and I thought the CP300 had the same sound as the P155, but I'm not certain.

Originally Posted By: bsl100
Also you have sent the P95 sample in the above project. Was it 1 layer or 3 layers?

Dewster's testing says one layer. It sounded like more than one layer to me, but I sent dewster a file intended to make it easier to hear the shifts, and his analysis still came up with one layer.

That said, as I've discussed before, ears are more important than specs. The P95 may only be one layer, but I find it more musical sounding than, for example, the 4-layer PX-130. Other people feel differently, but I'm not the only person who prefers the sound of the P95 either. So just like gradedness, polyphony, triple sensor, escapement... none of that matters nearly as much as how it sounds to your ears and feels to your fingers, and it's not at all uncommon for a board that seems somehow inferior on paper to be the more pleasurable one to play.
Posted by: bsl100

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 12:19 AM

The main difference is 128 polyphony in the CP300 vs 64 in the CP33. The P155 has Pure CF sampling with 4 layers.

We have a Clavinova CVP 503PE for home use which has the same 4 layer Pure CF sampling. Have been on the lookout for a lightweight DP for stage and church (for my daughter).

Had considered the CP33, but it's too heavy. The NP V80 is a choice as it has ensemble features (as the CVP) and it's lightweight. The P-105 is another choice as its still a managable 12kg and has 88 GHS keys (will not be too difficult to adjust to as compared to the CVP GH3 keys). It also has dedicated line outs and few pianist styles. Hopefully the sound will be better than the NP series. Will await reviews. Am hoping it will have at least 3 layers so that it's more expressive.
Posted by: bsl100

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 01:07 AM

Yamaha seems to use the AWM stereo sampling and AWM Dynamic stereo sampling terms to differentiate between a single layer and multiple layers.

Going thru the P95 manual, you'll come across the main features which mentions that it has stereo sampling for the GP voices 1 and 2 and multiple dynamic sampling for EP 1 and 2.

So it could be that the P-105 will also have 1 layer. Hope I'm proved wrong as I'm looking forward to this product.
Posted by: Poida

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 05:13 AM

I'll let you guys know how it is, I've got one coming in the next few days, whatever you want to know, just ask.
Posted by: BaR

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 09:11 AM

Originally Posted By: Poida
I'll let you guys know how it is, I've got one coming in the next few days, whatever you want to know, just ask.



I'll be curious to know if the volume slider controls the volume of the Line Outs, or are they fixed volume?
Posted by: Alfort

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 12:57 PM

Owner´s manual already at
http://europe.yamaha.com/en/products/mus...105/?mode=model
Let´s check it!
Posted by: PianoWorksATL

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 02:09 PM

From the manual:

"Grand Piano 1: Sampled from a concert grand piano. It uses different samples depending on the playing strength and produces smoother tonal changes. Suitable not only for classical compositions but also for any style music."

Clearly suggests multi-layer sample but doesn't specify the number. Let's keep hope alive. wink
Posted by: xorbe

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 02:13 PM

I thought the P105 got the P155 piano sounds. Is the P155 multi-layer?
Posted by: PianoWorksATL

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 02:22 PM

On the P155, the Pure CF is explicitly 4-layer. On the YDP-V240, I read somewhere from Yamaha that the Pure CF is 3-layer. Not sure yet about the P105 but specs do indicate some difference from the P155.

The P105 has "Damper Resonance DSP" not featured on the P155 but does not have "Stereo Sustain Samples" or "Key-Off Samples" present on the P155.

Wait and see.
Posted by: bsl100

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 09:06 PM

Pianoworks, good observation about the GP 1 sound. This is the language used by Yamaha for at least 3 layers.

Hope it's not a cut and paste from another manual and the P-105 is really a 3 layer sample.

With the line level outs and lighter weight, it should make for a good alternative to the P155 or CP33 for stage use. The GHS keys would be the only compromise.
Posted by: Possum SP280Krome

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 09:15 PM

Although I enjoyed listening to the demo, I don't think I would unscrew my P95, cragislist it for $250-280 and upgrade to the 105 just for one piano sound.
I would be more inclined to purchase a PX850 and then maybe move the 95 at some point.
Posted by: bsl100

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 09:28 PM

Possum95, I agree that the difference between the P-105 and P-95 does not justify an upgrade.

But, it would make sense to go for the P-105 as a first choice. The difference of $100 gets you a better sound engine, better speakers and output, 128 polyphony and Line level outs.
Posted by: anotherscott

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/04/12 11:49 PM

Originally Posted By: bsl100
Possum95, I agree that the difference between the P-105 and P-95 does not justify an upgrade.

But, it would make sense to go for the P-105 as a first choice. The difference of $100 gets you a better sound engine, better speakers and output, 128 polyphony and Line level outs.

Though there is also a trade-off, you lose the MIDI outputs. The adapter you can buy to restore that functionality is $180. And if some years from now that adapter fails, and the company isn't around, you may be stuck. Since MIDI connectivity is important to me, I would not buy a P-105. But I'd consider the P-35.
Posted by: Possum SP280Krome

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/06/12 10:46 PM

Originally Posted By: bsl100
Possum95, I agree that the difference between the P-105 and P-95 does not justify an upgrade.

But, it would make sense to go for the P-105 as a first choice. The difference of $100 gets you a better sound engine, better speakers and output, 128 polyphony and Line level outs.




Totally agree- especially for a first time buyer. I still might do it though, but I think that Casio is offering more in their upgrade with a different key touch.
In addition I think there is more of a difference in the x50 to x30 privia models
Posted by: maurus

Re: Better Yamaha P 105 demo from Yamaha site - 09/07/12 04:25 AM

IF you upgrade from a P95 that should really be to the next step up, and not just to a board with minor advantages. I.e. to instruments such as P155, MP6 etc., or comparable consoles if that's your cup of tea.