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#334221 - 11/16/07 02:30 PM Brodmann purchase
TammyF Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/16/05
Posts: 21
Loc: Castlegar, Canada
Some of you have been asking about the Brodmann Grands, so I thought I would fill you in our story:

Our teachers’ branch has just purchased a Brodmann Grand 187 on November 3rd. It will be used not only for events such as recitals and workshops, but it will be used as the piano for our conservatory examinations. Students travel from up to three hours away to do their exams here, so we needed a piano that is worthy of the task. Not only will beginner students be tested on this piano, but advanced senior students will be using it for their associate examinations.

The previous grand piano that we had was quite old and needed to be replaced. In fact the last examiner that we had come in June expressed her displeasure with the piano. She felt it was unfair for students preparing for exams, to have to do their exam on a piano that was not in top shape. I purchased an Estonia from Norbert Marten of Heritage Pianos two years ago, and was very impressed with his knowledge, honesty, and integrity. Thus I knew that he would be the one to check with about replacing this piano. Once again, Norbert was exceptional to deal with.

Myself, and three other teachers traveled 8 hours to try out the Brodmann Grands, and we were not disappointed. I had been reading and hearing about these pianos, and what great craftsmanship and sound they had. I remember two years ago I had played a Steigerman that was side by side with a Yamaha C2, and I had been astounded that I liked the Steigerman better than the Yamaha. Thus I was looking forward to see what the Brodmann had to offer. We took turns playing the Brodmann, Steigermans, Estonias, Sauters, Grotrians, and a new Haulin. Each of us also tried a different era of piano music just to see how the Brodmann handled Baroque to Classical, Romantic, Modern, and Jazz. If we had the money, I still would have bought an Estonia or Grotrian or Sauter, but the Brodmann Grands were exceptional for their beautiful tone and affordability. We were all amazed that this piano was better than many brands that cost 2 or 3 times as much!

Thank you Norbert for all your help once again. You have reaffirmed why I was impressed when I bought my Estonia from you, and I know that there are three other teachers now who feel the same way.

We are proud to say that our examination centre is going to have a Brodmann Grand and many, many students, teachers, and examiners, will come to know how special this piano is. If any of you are out there shopping around, do not hesitate to try out the Brodmann or Steigerman Premiums. They are amazing pianos, and not just for the money!

Tammy \:\)

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#334222 - 11/16/07 03:42 PM Re: Brodmann purchase
Keith D Kerman Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/03
Posts: 3249
Loc: Gaithersburg, MD (Washington D...
Congratulations on your purchase. The Brodmann 187 is exceptional and I am not surprised at all by your choice. Enjoy!
_________________________
Keith D Kerman
PianoCraft
Rebuilding & Sales of vintage and pre-owned Steinway and Mason & Hamlin
New Steingraeber, Estonia, Charles R. Walter, Brodmann, Feurich
www.pianocraft.net
http://www.youtube.com/user/pianocraftchannel/videos

keith@pianocraft.net 888-840-5460

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#334223 - 11/16/07 04:16 PM Re: Brodmann purchase
schwammerl Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/06
Posts: 2011
Loc: Belgium
TammyF

As you onw an Estonia 168 and you played the Brodmann 187, may I ask you how you would describe the difference in touch and tone between the two (if possible for different eras of music)?

Although the Brodmann is a 6'2" and the Estonia only a 5'6", neither of both are known to be 'powerhorses'; just curious.

schwammerl.

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#334224 - 11/16/07 05:40 PM Re: Brodmann purchase
swampwiz Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/07/07
Posts: 561
Loc: Louisiana, USA
I'd like to know what brands that are "2 or 3 times as much" cost that you found inferior to the Brodmann.

You have already mentioned that you find the Brodmann to be inferior to the Estonia, as you only decided against the Estonia because of the cost, so that would indicate that the Brodmann is priced below the Estonia. It was my understanding that Brodmann had raised prices substantially, but obviously not so high to overtake the Estonia.

It would seem from your experience that the Brodmann and Steigerman Premium should be rated as a Tier 3 piano, but Larry Fine has not officially done so as of yet.

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#334225 - 11/16/07 10:55 PM Re: Brodmann purchase
TammyF Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/16/05
Posts: 21
Loc: Castlegar, Canada
In terms of the touch, we had the Brodmann touch lightened up a bit and I haven't tried it yet. One of our teachers who is doing her associate exam is working on a very challenging Alexina Louie piece, and she found that the touch of the smaller Brodmann was more responsive, so they were adjusting it. The piece, "She Leaps through the Sky with Stars" needs a very quick repetition of notes.
It is harder to compare it to my Estonia at home as I played it there and not side by side with mine. I find the Estonia to have a sweeter sound if that makes sense. My absolute favourite music to play on my Estonia is Romantic music. It brings a smile to my face. Interestingly enough, I have a Young Chang that is about 12 years old in my teaching studio, and I like jazz on it better as it has more of a Yamaha type sound which seems to suite jazz music better. If I could only have one piano though, I would pick my Estonia over the Young Chang any day.
I would seriously buy it over a Yamaha (sorry Yamaha people), and if you had asked me that a few years ago, I would have bought a Yamaha hands down. Things are changing out there and if you can get a piano that good (as the Brodmann) for less than half the price, it may not have the track record yet, but it is a better choice for us.

I would definitely say that the Brodmann and Steigermans should be in a category much higher in Larry Fine's books, but I understand that he has to wait until they have proven themselves through time.

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#334226 - 11/16/07 11:30 PM Re: Brodmann purchase
Deerwood Dad Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/04/07
Posts: 478
Loc: Minneapolis
 Quote:
It would seem from your experience that the Brodmann and Steigerman Premium should be rated as a Tier 3 piano, but Larry Fine has not officially done so as of yet.
Swampwhiz -- you are nauseatingly predictable. Are Larry Fine ratings (a meaningful data point for almost everybody on this forum) your sole measure of a piano's merits? If anything, a piano's "value" in many (albeit not all) cases inversely correlates with Larry's ratings -- something Larry himself points out. I think it is safe to say that the Brodmann and Steigerman Premium may be such cases of inverse correlation -- the proverbial deeply discounted, likely soon to be recognized, value stocks of the piano world.
_________________________
Mason & Hamlin A (2006); Yamaha P140

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#334227 - 11/16/07 11:34 PM Re: Brodmann purchase
Furtwangler Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 1474
Loc: Danville, California
Tammy

May I ask what led you to choose the Brodmann over the Steigerman Premium?

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#334228 - 11/17/07 12:18 AM Re: Brodmann purchase
schwammerl Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/06
Posts: 2011
Loc: Belgium
 Quote:
I'd like to know what brands that are "2 or 3 times as much" cost that you found inferior to the Brodmann.
I think swampiz has a valuable question here. I can hardly be suspected of being negative towards Chinese pianos but I would also like to know which brands in a 2 to 3 X price range were inferior to the Brodmann.

If the choice was based on brands carried by Heritage it must be Grotrian, Sauter, Estonia. We already know it was not Estonia (190); so there is the Grotrian Cabinet (+/- 2.5 x the price), Sauter Delta (+/- 2 - 2.5 x the price) to stay in the same size range. Unless the teachers' branch has test driven other brands in that price segment that are not carrried by Heritage?

It may be of course that the teachers' branch had a maximum budget (? $ 17 - 18k) which they could not exceed and then found the Brodmann the best compromise? I often said I would personally pick a Brodmann, Steigerman Premium to any similar sized e.g. Yamaha C or Kawai RX, but never went as far.

 Quote:
In terms of the touch, we had the Brodmann touch lightened up a bit and I haven't tried it yet.
TammyF, this sounds strange to me as mostly the experience of others and myself is that the touch of the Brodmann 187 is on the lightier side, that it comes very well prepped out of the box and Norbert often said on this forum they spend quite some prepping time on the instruments in the showroom.

schwammerl.

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#334229 - 11/17/07 01:06 AM Re: Brodmann purchase
TammyF Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/16/05
Posts: 21
Loc: Castlegar, Canada
I think pricing is different here in Canada than in Belgium. The Grotrian and Sauters are I would say 3 to 3 1/2 times more than a Brodmann and our Branch did not have the funds to purchase those. The Brodmann fit our budget and what we were looking for. I may have been wrong in saying we liked it better than pianos 3 times the price, but in Canada Yamahas and Kawais are definitely 2 times the price.
As far as comparisons, we were comparing them to many other brands that Heritage pianos does not sell. One of the teachers owns a Kawai, another a Yamaha, and the third one a Petrof. Two of us have just got our grands in the last 3 years after years of trying many brands out. We all really enjoy our own pianos and it is interesting how a person develops a relationship with their own piano.

As for the touch, the Brodmann was great already, but Norbert has different pianos prepped slightly differently so that you can choose what suits your needs/likes the best. The smaller sized Brodmann was prepped the way we prefered so they adjusted this one for us.

I don't want disrespect other people's pianos, but this is what we found. It all comes down to personal taste and what one is looking for in the touch, sound, and type of music that will be played. What might be one person's dream piano is not anothers, but I know we are very happy with our decision. Since Brodmann is a newer, less familiar piano "on the block", I thought you may be interested in hearing more about it.

Tammy

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#334230 - 11/17/07 01:34 AM Re: Brodmann purchase
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 13965
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
Dear Tammy and all other teachers of the branch:

Thank you very much for your most generous report here!

Rest assured that we were indeed very honoured that your branch of the BCMTA made the choice for the Brodmann grand, driving such a long distance to us in Vancouver!

I hope the piano will live up to its high expectations - it's being used for concerts in your community as well - and we will certainly always go the extra mile to make everything perfect for you!

Thank you very much again and kind regards to all of you,

Norbert \:\)
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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#334231 - 11/17/07 09:43 AM Re: Brodmann purchase
Piano*Dad Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10297
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
schwammerl,

Ya gotta read, man! \:D

Your question:

 Quote:
I think swampiz has a valuable question here. I can hardly be suspected of being negative towards Chinese pianos but I would also like to know which brands in a 2 to 3 X price range were inferior to the Brodmann.

If the choice was based on brands carried by Heritage it must be Grotrian, Sauter, Estonia. We already know it was not Estonia (190); so there is the Grotrian Cabinet (+/- 2.5 x the price), Sauter Delta (+/- 2 - 2.5 x the price) to stay in the same size range.
but Tammy had already said this:

 Quote:
If we had the money, I still would have bought an Estonia or Grotrian or Sauter, but the Brodmann Grands were exceptional for their beautiful tone and affordability. We were all amazed that this piano was better than many brands that cost 2 or 3 times as much!
People are getting hung up on her little rhetorical phrase "that cost 2 or 3 times as much!" She did not note which pianos might fit that description, and in a later post she said she has no intention of initiating that kind of destructive commentary.

So, how about just getting back to the Brodmann ....by Bosendorfer..... ;\)
_________________________
Grotrian 192 #156455

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#334232 - 11/17/07 10:01 AM Re: Brodmann purchase
turandot Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/27/07
Posts: 7089
Loc: torrance, CA
By gum dad, you're right.

Let's see. It's not Grotrian, Sauter, or Estonia. I wonder what Tammy could mean. What pianos are often used by schools for performance trials???? Hey, I've got an idea.
_________________________
Will Johnny Come Marching Home?
The fate of the modern wartime soldier

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#334233 - 11/17/07 10:18 AM Re: Brodmann purchase
Piano*Dad Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10297
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
Oh, you troublemaker. \:\)
_________________________
Grotrian 192 #156455

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#334234 - 11/17/07 10:23 AM Re: Brodmann purchase
ASOP Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/08/06
Posts: 144
Loc: USA
Fact is Tammy really likes all of Norberts low, medium and high end pianos and believes the ones he doesn't sell are subpar.

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#334235 - 11/17/07 12:27 PM Re: Brodmann purchase
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 13965
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
 Quote:
Fact is Tammy really likes all of Norberts low, medium and high end pianos and believes the ones he doesn't sell are subpar.
I would never make the same assumption - bear in mind there are only so many makes to compare in Western Canada.....

However, as totally specialized and dedicated piano dealers, we have perhaps a certain edge in terms not only of the brands we chose but the attention we can give them.

I even get disturbed sometimes when the occasional lost soul comes into our store asking for guitar wire.....

Norbert \:D
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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