Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad) Pianoteq
Latest Pianoteq add-on instrument: U4 upright piano
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Topic Options
#1993085 - 12/01/12 06:19 AM Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner?
JanoSvk Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/13/12
Posts: 7
Loc: Slovakia
Hello guys

As I read the forums, I am going to be more and more confused. So I decided to as for some advice here. smile

I started to play piano one and a half year ago, in an age of 30. I decided to buy just an entry model of DP for the start (P-95).
I started attend the school too. After some months I realized, that my actual piano is not satisfying me. Its touch is not the one for me. It is difficult to play
pp for instance. The sound can be better too. Each time when I sit in front of grand and play it, I am in other world, like at home. smile I want to record the music directly to USB too.
So I decided to buy a new one.

My budget is somewhere around 2500€. It have to be a stage piano, because in the future I want to play for people too, not only for me at home.
And I do not want to buy another one next years.

Now I am going to serious confusion. At first place is for me of course the keys action. I can not compare much, because I do not have well supplied stores near by.
I played for couple of minutes RD-700NX and CP-1. From these, CP-1's action felt much better for me. But I am afraid, that with its light touch I will have problems in school,
with play on acoustics.

To go to the point, I have a lot of possibilities.

CP-5
I really like it's keybed, especialy because I have problems with carpal tunnel syndrome (a lot of computer in my life smile ). But I am afraid for a bad habbits (problems with acoustics),
because I am just beginer.
Piano sound does not impressed me much, but I heard only preset sounds.
Price around 2200€.

RD-700NX
It's keybed was not so pleasant like that on CP-1 for me. But maybe I just played it a short time. Other thing is piano sound. It sounded better like on CP-1. I am still speaking about preset.
Small negative here is even a price, around 2500€.

MP-10
Seems nice, its sound from demo mp3 which I downloaded is very nice for me. I heard a lot of positives about keybed too. It have probably tougher action.
I am not sure, if it will be not a problem for my hand, to play it for a longer time without a break. But it will be closer to acoustics like CP-5.
Price around 2200€.

When I read the forum, I found some ideas, that for me will be maybe sufficient some cheaper solution like MP-6/ES7 (1400€), FP7F/FP4F(1900-1500€), (yea, I can have a wooden stand! smile ),
CP-50 (1500€), and save the money for better headphones and monitors. Actually I do not need a lot of functions in DP, but it can be changed (I hope it will) in the future.
I am afraid too that in some from these models, the action and sound will be not so much better from my actuall (P-95) piano, so not worth to buy it.
So now I am completely confused.

Can you please help me to go out from this? Correct some wrong ideas I wrote? smile
A DP for "a student", who want to gig a bit in the future, and like to play more modern songs like classical, under 2500€?

Top
(ad) Roland

Click Here

#1993086 - 12/01/12 06:23 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
Dr Popper Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/30/09
Posts: 1706
Loc: Hancock Park LA (not again)
RD700NX .... without a doubt
_________________________
"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally supported by but not beholden to various musical instrument manufactures including Yamaha

Top
#1993090 - 12/01/12 06:42 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: Dr Popper]
Amaruk Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/02/11
Posts: 795
Loc: New England, USA
Originally Posted By: Dr Popper
RD700NX .... without a doubt

+1
_________________________
My latest piano cover on YouTube: Yann Tiersen - Mother's Journey

Top
#1993130 - 12/01/12 09:46 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: Dr Popper]
KarelG Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/18/11
Posts: 132
Loc: Czech Republic
Originally Posted By: Dr Popper
RD700NX .... without a doubt

I'm also interested in this question so I wonder what 700NX will bring in comparison with asked Fp-7F? Am I right both provides exactly the same keyboard except that NX provides wood-like plastic color while Fp-7F probably just pure white on all white keys from all sides? So why to spend more money on NX?
Thanks!
Karel
_________________________
November 2011: piano entered into my life.

Top
#1993143 - 12/01/12 10:36 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: Dr Popper]
Kawai James Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8417
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: Dr Popper
RD700NX .... without a doubt


No love for the MP10, Dr P?
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#1993152 - 12/01/12 10:57 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
I'm not sure why you guys are saying the Roland. The OP tried it and didn't like it. If there's one piano on the list that probably won't work, it's that one.

The Kawai will have a different action, which you may like. Nice soft bottoming out though more mass to it. I'd give it a shot before making up your mi nd. I personally don't think sound is its strong point compared to the Roland and Yamaha you tried, but sound is really a secondary concern. Gigging isn't a circumstance where people can be very discriminating because of poor acoustics and speakers. It sounds like in your personal playing you require very nice sounds if the CP5 didn't satisfy. Probably you will be best served with a VST in that case.

The CP5 is also still a decent option. It has a lighter touch, but not outside the reasonable realm and you clearly already like it. Again, sound is secondary.

Top
#1993233 - 12/01/12 02:21 PM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
spanishbuddha Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 2240
Loc: UK
If you have hand or wrist problems I would avoid the Roland's. The key action bottoms out hard, and can be tiring as well as cause sore fingers (for the susceptible). Several people with hand problems here, me included, have come to this conclusion after playing them.

The Kawai's are better in this respect but you need to try them for yourself, and also like the basic Kawia sound, although that can be replaced with a VST.

Top
#1993342 - 12/01/12 06:38 PM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: KarelG]
Dr Popper Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/30/09
Posts: 1706
Loc: Hancock Park LA (not again)
Originally Posted By: KarelG
Originally Posted By: Dr Popper
RD700NX .... without a doubt

I'm also interested in this question so I wonder what 700NX will bring in comparison with asked Fp-7F? Am I right both provides exactly the same keyboard except that NX provides wood-like plastic color while Fp-7F probably just pure white on all white keys from all sides? So why to spend more money on NX?
Thanks!
Karel


Nope the RD700NX has the Studio Grand ....which is the best sounding piano on the DP.
_________________________
"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally supported by but not beholden to various musical instrument manufactures including Yamaha

Top
#1993344 - 12/01/12 06:40 PM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: Kawai James]
Dr Popper Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/30/09
Posts: 1706
Loc: Hancock Park LA (not again)
Originally Posted By: Kawai James
Originally Posted By: Dr Popper
RD700NX .... without a doubt


No love for the MP10, Dr P?


Oh don't get me wrong I like the MP10 very much James best interface ever amongst other class leading features.... but I think the NX is a better DP.
_________________________
"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally supported by but not beholden to various musical instrument manufactures including Yamaha

Top
#1993535 - 12/02/12 06:51 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
JanoSvk Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/13/12
Posts: 7
Loc: Slovakia
Thanks a lot for the comments.
So far, noone adviced me to buy a cheaper model and save the many, so I think the higher level will be worth its price.

@spanishbuddha, gvfarns: Do you think that MP10's action will be somewhere between RD700NX and CP5 regarding the wrist fatigue?

At first I was ready to buy CP5, but then I began to be afraid of bad habits and problems at school when play acoustics, because CP5's keyboard seems for me to be much away from realistic, like others in this price level. Can be this really a problem? But anyway, I found it very pleasant for playing and I enjoyed it. smile

I will try to go out to Wien or Prag for Chrismass markets and try Kawai maybe, to make my own opinion. Unfortunatelly, I have no possibility to play it in my country, because they are not sold here.

Top
#1993538 - 12/02/12 07:10 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
Kawai James Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8417
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted By: JanoSvk
Unfortunatelly, I have no possibility to play it in my country, because they are not sold here.


If 'here' is Slovakia, the following store may be able to assist you:

http://www.mshop.sk/klavesove-nastroje/stage-piana/kawai-mp-10-stage-piano.html

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#1993542 - 12/02/12 07:37 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
JanoSvk Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/13/12
Posts: 7
Loc: Slovakia
Oh, thanks James. Shame on me, but I did not know they are selling Kawai, neither I did not know about their e-shop. smile
I will call them tomorrow, if they have some MP10 on store and will be possible to play one.

Top
#1993949 - 12/03/12 01:26 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: JanoSvk
@spanishbuddha, gvfarns: Do you think that MP10's action will be somewhere between RD700NX and CP5 regarding the wrist fatigue?


Hard question to answer. The Kawai and Roland are fatiguing in different ways. People often complain about the hard bottoming out of the Roland, though its action is not considered heavy by most. I definitely found it to bottom out pretty hard, but I'm not sure I'd call it fatiguing. The jarring can cause pain in some people but I have never played it long enough to find out for myself. We get mixed reviews about the fatigue aspect of the Kawais. They definitely bottom out softer (I own one of the previous generation) but many feel that they have more mass to them, which can be fatiguing in its own way. My MP8 definitely makes you work and can tire you out if you aren't in shape for it. Acoustic pianos span this range. Some are jarring, others perhaps less so. Some are massive, others less so.

Unfortunately, I have never been able to find a CP5 or CP1 in a store near me, so I can't comment about them except to sum up what I have read here and elsewhere. They are not graded (so the bass notes are not heavier than the treble) and they are considered noticeably lighter/quicker than the GH3. As for comparing to the Roland, perhaps someone else has been able to play one after the other.


Edited by gvfarns (12/03/12 01:27 AM)

Top
#1993973 - 12/03/12 03:52 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
spanishbuddha Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 2240
Loc: UK
Originally Posted By: JanoSvk

@spanishbuddha, gvfarns: Do you think that MP10's action will be somewhere between RD700NX and CP5 regarding the wrist fatigue?


I don't think that wrist fatigue is caused by the hard bottoming out, but something else, possibly the pushback of the keys after they have been depressed. In which case that could be my bad technique, but it's worse on some keyboards than others. I have not played the MP10 but have played Kawai with the same RM3 action and found them to be easier than the Roland PHAIII, even though as gvfarns says the Roland's are claimed to be light. You do really need to try for yourself, 10 minutes or so on scales and arpeggios, or something with a walking or Alberti bass, and see how they compare for you.

Top
#1993980 - 12/03/12 04:34 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
Marco M Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/28/12
Posts: 447
Loc: Europe
Originally Posted By: JanoSvk
... I began to be afraid of bad habits and problems at school when play acoustics, because XXX-DIGITALPIANO keyboard seems for me to be much away from realistic ...

I much worried about this too, until I got the chance to side by side put my hands on plenty of acoustic pianos (uprights and grands), for testing their actions: the actions of the acoustics are all so different, between upright and grand, but even between upright and upright and between grand and grand, that I concluded that for the digital piano (in the price range > 1800 EUR) I just have to make my choice on what feeling I prefer but not intending to compare to much with acoustics. Because I first would have to define which of the particular acoustics should be my reference then. I found, that the DPs in the price range we are speaking about all feature actions in the 'realistic' range and are very accetable.
So, if you define your school´s acoustic piano as your reference, then you can search for the DP coming closest to it. If you don´t want to define your school´s acoustic as the gold standard for you, then better go for your very personal preference and just be happy with it being one of the many possible good decisions.
_________________________
learning Piano on my Roland HP-505
before playing Drums in adults bluesband on handpicked set; before crashing E-Guitar in kids garage band; raised on home entertainment Organ and Keyboard models Eminent Solina P240, Farfisa Maharani 259R, Technics KN800, and on Mouth Organ, Recorder and Accordion

Top
#1996943 - 12/09/12 01:51 PM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
JanoSvk Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/13/12
Posts: 7
Loc: Slovakia
@Marco M: Thanks for your opinion. After read even other topics I decided to do not worry about habits. I will just try to spend so much time on acoustics as possible, and keep differences in mind. :o)

@Kawai James: Unfortunately, Slovakia is a small market and our Kawai dealer has no MP10 on stock and do not plan to have it in the near future. I can actually just buy it without try.


Just for have my mind calm, I am still thinking about trip to Prag (400km smirk ), to try MP10. Otherwise I will go for CP5, because its action seems well for me.

But I have the other funny question. Will be worth it to wait for the NAMM show, if some new models will be announced? Are you expecting some news in this price range (2000-2500$/€)?

Thanks
Jan

Top
#1997034 - 12/09/12 06:06 PM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
I have no inside information, but given the fact that Kawai now has a new wood action in their top pianos and the MP10 is their flagship stage piano, I would not be surprised to see a replacement for it to come out soon, perhaps at NAMM. In fact, I'd be a little disappointed if this did not happen. Of course, I've been disappointed before...

Actually, the GF keys are longer, so they may choose not to put them in any stage pianos. This kind of thing is not uncommon (for example Yamaha has not chosen to put any triple sensor actions in their stage line even in their very high end CP1).


Edited by gvfarns (12/09/12 06:06 PM)

Top
#1999588 - 12/14/12 09:35 PM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
ONfrank Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/27/11
Posts: 98
Originally Posted By: JanoSvk
But I have the other funny question. Will be worth it to wait for the NAMM show, if some new models will be announced? Are you expecting some news in this price range (2000-2500$/€)?


I believe the MP6 and MP10 were released in mid 2010 so 2013 would be year 3. Kawai seems to be aggressively pushing out the 3-sensor actions to their new digitals so I wouldn't be surprised to see new stage boards soon.

Top
#2003780 - 12/24/12 05:13 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
JanoSvk Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/13/12
Posts: 7
Loc: Slovakia
So, guys, I finally bought the CP5. I have it at home fifth day, spend with it more like 20 hours in that time.
My feelings has varied from "waw" at first to "ehm" followed with "hmm" and "grrr". But now I am back on "waw" and enjoying the play.

In short I can say that my hands are doing well with the keys. Almost no hand soreness or fatigue. I like that. Keytop is very good on touch, when I compare it with P95 keytop, it is 100:1.
But I got angry at the interface. I spend two hours just to make one simple preset with splited keys. Very annoyning. It seems for me like cheats on PC games in the 90's; "Open the console an then press #4gjaff3! to unlock immortality." But ok, I will learn that in time.
I got the original CP5's music rest for free, although it was not listed in accessory list. Nice suprise. Took even the AKG k240mkII. Nice sound with them and they are very light and comfortable.
I can write some review in january and comparison with P95 if someone will want to read that. smile

Wish you all Merry christmass. I allready have.

Top
#2003781 - 12/24/12 05:15 AM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
Kawai James Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8417
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Congrats Jano!

Merry Christmas indeed!

James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

Top
#2005030 - 12/27/12 03:45 PM Re: Stage DP bellow 2500€ for a beginner? [Re: JanoSvk]
Marco M Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/28/12
Posts: 447
Loc: Europe
Congratulations, and Merry Christmas!
Don´t worry too much about the antique interface of your particular DP model, other DPs are not better at it. Seems that we just have to stand this drawback on DPs, until design engineers will become replaced. Imagin how frustrated I was when not finding simple things implemented well or not implemented at all, which my old entertainer keyboard has had already 25 years ago...
_________________________
learning Piano on my Roland HP-505
before playing Drums in adults bluesband on handpicked set; before crashing E-Guitar in kids garage band; raised on home entertainment Organ and Keyboard models Eminent Solina P240, Farfisa Maharani 259R, Technics KN800, and on Mouth Organ, Recorder and Accordion

Top

Moderator:  Piano World 
What's Hot!!
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Interesting books about the piano, pianists, piano history, biographies, memoirs and more!
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
Download & Print Sheet Music Instantly
sheet music search
sheet music search

sheet music search
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
162 registered (36251, alfredo capurso, accordeur, 54 invisible), 1768 Guests and 35 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
74300 Members
42 Forums
153683 Topics
2252765 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Piano Cover of Luke Bryan "Drink a Beer"
by Zach Evans
04/23/14 05:36 PM
Boris Slutsky to perform at PianoCraft on May 3
by Keith D Kerman
04/23/14 05:06 PM
Boris Slutsky to perform at PianoCraft May 3
by Keith D Kerman
04/23/14 05:05 PM
Hi Mr S-H and all
by Seaside_Lee
04/23/14 04:13 PM
A Steinway for under 1,500...
by Juln
04/23/14 04:09 PM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission