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#2004178 - 12/25/12 01:26 AM Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware
forager1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 18
Loc: Washington state
Goal: Update Kawai MP8 firmware from version 1.30 to Kawai's current 2.15. There is a USB port on the Kawai. I've tried to update via USB and MediaPlayer, which is referenced in the instructions for the update; but, while the downloaded update file plays in MediaPlayer when I open it--that is, the MediaPlayer's progress indicator moves--the Kawai display window does not correspondingly change its status, which is supposed to happen, according to the instructions. Do I need a MIDI sequencer software program for this process?

Normally, when I plug in a USB device, Windows provides a lettered drive in the "My Computer" window. However, that doesn't happen here. When I first connect the piano to the computer via USB, Windows briefly says the new hardware is installed and ready to use, but I can't find the device in the system. With respect to MIDI settings, I could find only a couple of unhelpful menus in Control Panel. I have no experience with MIDI files.

Obviously, I don't understand the process. I've tried many times to do this. Any recommendations as to MIDI software sequencer programs (if needed) and/or any detailed updating instructions would be greatly appreciated.

Steve

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#2004279 - 12/25/12 12:09 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
The MP8 update is done purely via MIDI, and I believe I did it though windows media player, so it should work. As I recall, one has to boot up the digital piano while holding down a few of the buttons (described in the documents somewhere) to put it in firmware update mode. Then play the update file. Did you do that?

I'm trying to remember the details (it's been a few years). Does one have to switch windows media player into sequencer mode or something? Let me know if you correctly booted the MP8 into update mode. If you still have problems we can look into this in more detail.

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#2004331 - 12/25/12 03:35 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: gvfarns]
forager1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 18
Loc: Washington state
Thanks for the reply. Yes, I hold down buttons 6,7 & 8, as instructed, while I power on the piano. The display then reads "Flash Programming wait command", as expected.
Step 2 of the process tells you to set the playback of your sequencer to 70 BPM. However, the instructions for step 2 go on to say that if you use MediaPlayer that setting is not needed.
Step 3 begins with "Start the playback", which I take to mean open the downloaded file in MediaPlayer. When I open the file, MediaPlayer appears to process the file, because its progress indicator moves as if playing the file. According to the Kawai instructions, once you "Start the playback", the MP8's display will show "Erase" and then "Data Packet", etc. After the transmission, "End of file" should appear. However, none of the display changes occur after the initial "Flash Programming wait command" readout. I've opened the downloaded file a number of times, and let it run to completion in MediaPlayer; nothing changes. I've tried "starting the playback" by opening the file in MediaPlayer and also by clicking directly on the file. In each instance, Mediaplayer processes the file in the same way.
Step 4 Instructs you to reboot the piano, then check to see if the display window reflects the update.
I keep a printout of the instructions by the piano, and have followed them closely each time I try to perform the update.
I've rechecked the downloaded file; it is the correct file for the MP8 update. I also found a Kawai link to a USB driver package for Windows 32-bit machines. I successfully installed the driver, but the update continues to fail as described above.

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#2004333 - 12/25/12 03:40 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
Hmmm. If you download a random piano midi from the internet and play it in windows media player (with your piano in normal mode) does it play the music through the piano? If not, time to start messing with the settings in windows media player and maybe windows. Get that working first, then move to the step of playing the upgrade midi.

If you keep having problems, try using a different program. Test it first by playing the music midi you download. If it works, you are set to do it with the update file.

Midi upgrades are, unfortunately, often problematic. I feel your pain. I remmeber having all these same types of problems. Unfortunately I don't remember the solution.

Also, be careful with these midi updates. They are supposed to be reversable and non-destructive, but they are not. The first time I upgraded (when I first bought the piano), I used a great big long USB cable to update and somehow it broke my piano beyond repair and Kawai had to send someone to replace the main brain board. I upgraded again just a couple of years ago and it was fine, but I'm paranoid about midi upgrades.


Edited by gvfarns (12/25/12 03:43 PM)

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#2004362 - 12/25/12 06:29 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: gvfarns]
forager1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 18
Loc: Washington state
Thanks again for replying.
I'm using a 5' USB cord to connect the piano to the computer. There appears to be a connection, as Windows recognizes the Kawai driver when I connect the computer. But the connection appears to be limited to the recognition only.
Hopefully, the mainboard won't be damaged. I live somewhat remotely, and there is no chance that I could induce a Kawai technician to repair it.
If anyone has a recommendation for an alternative MIDI program(s) and/or suggestions, I would appreciate it.
Steve

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#2004378 - 12/25/12 08:39 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
Kawai James Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8437
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Steve, may I ask which version of Windows (and Windows Media Player) you are using?

I believe those MP8 update instructions were written some time ago, assuming the use of Windows XP or earlier. If you're using Windows Vista, 7, or 8, the behaviour of MIDI playback in Media Player may well have changed.

One possible solution might be to use the Roland SMF player referenced in this MP4 update thread:

http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/1989222

As gvfarns notes, updating an instrument's firmware via MIDI can be rather troublesome. Fortunately most modern Kawai instruments feature a 'USB to Device' connector, allowing straight-forward software updates via USB flash memory.

I hope this helps,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2004403 - 12/25/12 10:21 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
bachmaniac Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/01/06
Posts: 410
Loc: Montreal, CAN
Hey Steve,

you are trying to do exactly what I succeeded in doing with my own MP8 a couple of years ago, when I upgraded it to 2.14. Maybe, as I have read in some of the other replies, the Windows version is critical. I used Windows XP Home, SP3 and proceeded via the USB port also. Now be sure that your MP8, as it is before attempting anything, will play .mid files routed to it from your computer. If it doesn't even play files from the computer at this point, no use expecting it to "play" the upgrade file. Look into your MP8 owner's manual and make sure you first reset your MP8 to factory specs before attempting anything further. I'm saying this because there might not be a channel that's presently open between your computer and piano at this time. Resetting the piano and assigning it as output device to your computer's .mid file execution will insure it is receiving the upgrade file just as it would any other .mid file. James also pointed out that the behavior of Window's Media Player might be different under Win 7 or Vista, or any version of Windows other than XP. Don't give up, this has to work, my own experience testifies to it.

Hope this can shed a little more light on the situation...

Claude


Edited by bachmaniac (12/25/12 10:24 PM)
_________________________
K. Kawai KG-2D grand, Kawai MP8 digital, Kawai CA7

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#2004406 - 12/25/12 10:30 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: Kawai James]
forager1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 18
Loc: Washington state
James,
Windows XP SP3 and MediaPlayer 11. I'll take a look at the MP4 thread.
Thanks,
Steve

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#2004431 - 12/25/12 11:29 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
forager1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 18
Loc: Washington state
Good news and bad news!

The good: I found a way to point my midi-out program to the Kawai-downloaded USB driver that I alluded to earlier. When I started the downloaded midi file, all the expected readouts occurred, resulting in a successfully-updated readout of ver. 2.15.

The bad: No sound whatsoever from the piano, either from the external speakers or the headphones.

I've rebooted the piano and speakers numerous times, but no change.

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#2004437 - 12/25/12 11:49 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
Not to worry yet. I have the feeling that happened to me as well. Factory reset or something is required IIRC.

If it outputs a bunch of garbled sounds, like it's shifting constantly from one instrument to another, start worrying.

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#2004448 - 12/26/12 12:07 AM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: gvfarns]
forager1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 18
Loc: Washington state
I finally got sounds. After pushing a gazillion buttons, using no method towards the end, a Concert Grand note suddenly struck, startling me. The tones of the other voices are markedly improved (and louder--much louder,it seems).
The anomalies: the reverb button blinks continuously and the sounds occur only if the "setup" button is illuminated. I think that previously the "sound" button was illuminated when the piano emitted sound, but I'm not sure. I'm adjusting everything in cautious half-steps, so that I don't lose my way.
If any new developments occur, I'll add to the thread. I need to find a tutorial on digital pianos--something beyond the manual. The MP8 has so many functions, it would be easy to get lost in its labyrinth.
Steve

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#2004449 - 12/26/12 12:16 AM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
Did you already try the factory reset in the system menu? I really think you should if not. Someone else had this problem a while back and found that the system reset was required after the update to make things work right.


Edited by gvfarns (12/26/12 12:21 AM)

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#2004453 - 12/26/12 12:45 AM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
forager1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 18
Loc: Washington state
I didn't try the factory reset. At this point, wouldn't that reset the version to 1.30? I'm not challenging your assertion, mind you--just asking. When I power-on the MP8, it defaults to--that is, illuminates--the "sound" button, but no sounds occur with that configuraton. However, when I press the setup button (right below the sound button), it toggles off the sound button and the sounds occur--this time with the "setup" button illuminated.
The updating instructions state that when "End of File appears [in the display window]...turn off the MP8 and on again to check if the update was successful" (slightly paraphrased). The instructions did not refer to saving the file before shutting down, as one might do, say, with a Windows file in a conventional data processing environment.
I'm fairly confident that I followed the instructions as written. But the piano may be in some odd state of limbo. I've powered the piano on and off, checking to see if it is holding its current configuration. It seems to be. I'm not sure what to do.

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#2004456 - 12/26/12 12:49 AM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
Kawai James Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8437
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Yes, 'Reset All' in the SYSTEM menu should fix it.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2004463 - 12/26/12 01:33 AM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
Your caution does you credit.

Reset all will not set you back to 1.3. At this point you'd have to do a firmware downgrade in order to get back to the previous version. The previous firmware has been permanently overwritten and won't come back unless you do a firmware downgrade using a similar process.

Reset all clears out all your settings and stuff. Temporary files, that kind of thing.


Edited by gvfarns (12/26/12 01:35 AM)

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#2004464 - 12/26/12 01:35 AM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: Kawai James]
forager1 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 18
Loc: Washington state
My thanks to everyone. The "reset all" command fixed everything: no anomalies. The update is definitely worth it. The initial problem was my not coupling the MIDI file with the Kawai-provided USB driver.
I finally coupled them by using the default midi device drop-down menu in the "Sounds and Audio Devices" applet in the XP control panel. Once done, the process flowed sweetly, save my neglecting to "reset all" at the end. I wish the Kawai instructions included that last point.
Steve


Edited by forager1 (12/26/12 01:37 AM)

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#2004465 - 12/26/12 01:37 AM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
gvfarns Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 3474
Loc: Pennsylvania
They probably will in the future if such things are needed. I think Kawai_James writes things like that (at the very least he knows the people who do).

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#2004468 - 12/26/12 01:58 AM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
Kawai James Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 8437
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
forager1, I'm glad to hear that the update was successful.

I was not involved with the MP8/MP8II documentation and update instructions, however I shall recommend that the information is revised accordingly.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#2004947 - 12/27/12 01:10 PM Re: Definitely a "newb" question about updating firmware [Re: forager1]
bachmaniac Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/01/06
Posts: 410
Loc: Montreal, CAN
Hi again, Steve

I thought you had grasped from my earlier post that the piano needed to be reset after updating the firmware. Of course, "reset all" will not cancel your firmware upgrade, but it will give you a factory-new instrument with the 2.15 firmware installed. I'm glad you were finally able to figure everything out.

Now make sure you have both the MP8 and the MP8II Kawai manuals close at hand. Your new piano being some sort of a "hybrid" between these two models, you need to refer to both manuals occasionally, mainly to that of the MP8II. They are readily available from the Kawai site, so make sure you print a hard copy of each if you don't already have them at hand.

Enjoy!!!

Claude
_________________________
K. Kawai KG-2D grand, Kawai MP8 digital, Kawai CA7

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