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#2007352 - 01/01/13 07:01 AM An Opportunity for Digital Maufacturers . .
peterws Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 6006
Loc: Northern England.
I`ve been having a look at history regarding Beethoven and Chopin. The kinds of pianos they played (pianos were in their infancy then and had serious problems)

Chopin favoured a light touch, and a piano with a thinnish clear sound. Beethoven was hwavy handed and strident. Even before his deafness set in, he favoured the Broadwood (London) piano; one was specially made for him.

The point I`m making, is - a DP maker could actually replicate the sound of a vintage piano (or two) into an instrument; giving a background as to the reasons, and tips on how best to use this. Because it seems that modern grands promote express train delivery which is not wholly in line with that which the composer intended.

Perhaps because he never had such an instrument in the first place . . .Could be pianos have moved on after all.



Edited by peterws (01/01/13 07:02 AM)
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#2007354 - 01/01/13 07:08 AM Re: An Opportunity for Digital Maufacturers . . [Re: peterws]
EssBrace Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/09
Posts: 2914
Loc: Suffolk, United Kingdom
Some DP makers have "pianoforte" voices. There's one on the V-Piano and I think some other Rolands. That is a much earlier iteration of the modern instrument. I disagree that modern pianos give an "express train delivery". That's down to the player, not the instrument! Modern pianos have a lot of power in reserve and project much more than very old instruments but you don't have to use all that power. Modern tastes dictate that in all likelihood we really wouldn't enjoy playing or listening to very early pianos.
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#2007497 - 01/01/13 02:37 PM Re: An Opportunity for Digital Maufacturers . . [Re: peterws]
Wuffski Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/28/12
Posts: 514
Loc: Europe (Northern Spain)
Commercials claim that in the Roland HP 500 series would be some antique pianos featured. They can be recalled on the console in the voice bank called "early". But there is no information available, which antique instruments in particular those should imitate. So, only of very limited help, just some piano alike sounds more, but not what you (and many others) are actually searching for.
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#2007532 - 01/01/13 03:42 PM Re: An Opportunity for Digital Maufacturers . . [Re: peterws]
fizikisto Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/13/12
Posts: 1532
Loc: Hernando, MS
I read some time ago an article about the actual piano that mozart owned. Apparently it has been restored and is in a museum somewhere. Occasionally it's still played at special events. I thought at the time that I would love for that piano to be sampled. I wonder how many other great historic instruments still exist for similar treatment. If any company came out with a high quality sampling of such instruments, well I'd just tell them to shut up and take my money. smile
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#2007555 - 01/01/13 04:22 PM Re: An Opportunity for Digital Maufacturers . . [Re: fizikisto]
bennevis Online   content
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/14/10
Posts: 8715
Originally Posted By: fizikisto
I read some time ago an article about the actual piano that mozart owned. Apparently it has been restored and is in a museum somewhere. Occasionally it's still played at special events. I thought at the time that I would love for that piano to be sampled. I wonder how many other great historic instruments still exist for similar treatment. If any company came out with a high quality sampling of such instruments, well I'd just tell them to shut up and take my money. smile


I've played on one of Mozart's fortepianos, in the Mozarthaus in Salzburg. Like all fortepianos, it has light keyweight and shallow key travel as well as shallow tone and poor sustain by the standards of modern pianos (or even by the standards of the pianos - Erards and Pleyels - played by Chopin and the young Liszt). There are fortepiano specialists who perform and record Haydn, Mozart and Beethoven on restored period instruments, or (rather more frequently) on modern reproductions of them by Paul McNulty or Derek Adlam etc, among them Ronald Brautigam, Kristian Bezuidenhout and Robert Levin. You can probably find some performances by them on YouTube, if you want to hear what fortepianos sound like. The Pleyel and Erard grands sound much more like today's pianos but their wooden frames still don't give them the power and depth of modern pianos.

I don't think many pianists today will want to play much on fortepianos, not even the music of the Classical era. You do have to change the way you play somewhat, relying much more on finger technique, and keeping your wrists supple.

My V-Piano's 'Fortepiano' preset is fun to play on occasionally, but I do get the feeling of a mismatch between the modern key action (keyweight and travel) and the sound.......
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#2007631 - 01/01/13 07:10 PM Re: An Opportunity for Digital Maufacturers . . [Re: EssBrace]
peterws Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 6006
Loc: Northern England.
Originally Posted By: EssBrace
Some DP makers have "pianoforte" voices. There's one on the V-Piano and I think some other Rolands. That is a much earlier iteration of the modern instrument. I disagree that modern pianos give an "express train delivery". That's down to the player, not the instrument! Modern pianos have a lot of power in reserve and project much more than very old instruments but you don't have to use all that power. Modern tastes dictate that in all likelihood we really wouldn't enjoy playing or listening to very early pianos.


You`re probably right there. But wouldn`t it be good to hear and experience what they had to put up with? I had an 1850 7foot6 Broadwood and it wouldn`t pass muster these days. But it sounded good.
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#2007657 - 01/01/13 08:26 PM Re: An Opportunity for Digital Maufacturers . . [Re: peterws]
ando Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 4928
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: peterws


You`re probably right there. But wouldn`t it be good to hear and experience what they had to put up with?


It might, but we aren't going to encourage DP manufacturers to start trying to build digital versions of them - complete with their small sound and flimsy actions, are we? Basically, you aren't going to get anything like the experience of an early instrument unless you go and play one in a museum or an early music club of some sort.

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#2007972 - 01/02/13 01:13 PM Re: An Opportunity for Digital Maufacturers . . [Re: ando]
peterws Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/21/12
Posts: 6006
Loc: Northern England.
"It might, but we aren't going to encourage DP manufacturers to start trying to build digital versions of them - complete with their small sound and flimsy actions, are we?"

One of the reasons I put this on, was the digital organ I played at the Crem. It had a "classical" setting (in addition to the "traditional" one), although the pedals still worked on this. It was very sharp and had an attraction all of it`s own; it may have been sampled from some suitable instrument(s), I don`t know. But the clergy seemed to like it! Which meant I got to keep my job . . .

And I`d like to hear all this in a convenient form on a digital piano. Don`t forget, the sound of any piano or organ, is different the further away you get from them. Now, that is another possibility for the digital . . . heck,

To this there is no end!
Jump aboard, my friend . . .



Edited by peterws (01/02/13 01:14 PM)
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