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#2059419 - 04/04/13 05:30 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: pianoloverus]
laguna_greg Offline
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Registered: 04/02/13
Posts: 1166
Loc: guess where in CA and WA
I think hoola is confusing a lack of acoustical definition in the bass of that piano with some obscurity caused by a very broad use of the pedal.
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#2059433 - 04/04/13 05:46 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
Steven Y. A. Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/14/13
Posts: 291
Loc: Toronto
one interesting aspect I found out is that airy and mellow tone are very difficult to record and to replay.
the rich and intensive tone from Steinway and Bechstein are very recording friendly - the recording still sound different from the real thing but very pleasing.
i have not heard a decent recording with august forster yet - the airy piano sound is in my head but the recordings were nothing like it. even from the movie "the pianist"
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#2059457 - 04/04/13 06:30 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
Furtwangler Offline
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Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 1474
Loc: Danville, California
You want August Foerster? We give you August Foerster.


How about this:



I don't know who this kid is but he is fantastic.

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#2060105 - 04/05/13 11:46 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
newgeneration Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/04/09
Posts: 428
Loc: Richmond Hill, Ontario
Wow, what an opinionated discussion so far. I'll add mine to the mix:

I tend to lean toward the side that Steinway today maintains its reputation more on marketing efforts then a current, modern attempt at continued development of its brand legacy.
A long time ago, they were the leader of piano engineering and design leaving a trail of patents that contributed to piano building over a century ago.
Where has that drive and determination gone? Rather than acting as a leader in their industry by way of efforts in continuous development, they seem to be resting on the laurels of their past generations of operations.
In most industries, these types of companies eventually wake up one day to realize that they have lost their competitive edge and simply cannot catch up to the competition and/or changes in environment around them. Their last ditch attempt is to insist everything is fine, and they still see themselves in the mirror as the mighty giant they were 3 generations ago.

Where would Steinway be if Samick did not come to the rescue just a few years ago? Much of what made Steinway great a long time ago, as a leader in the industry, is non-existent today and it is ironic that Samick who only 10-15 years ago was seen as entry-level at best, is the company that saved the mighty Steinway.

We all are fully aware of the potential a Steinway can have once it is sold to a concert hall in North America and then proceeds to receive a phenomenal amount of technical work followed by years of regular, sometimes daily, servicing. These particular concert grands in all likelihood would not travel more than 40-50ft from the spot to which they were first delivered. For anyone who has commented or inferred that they question the aging (stability) of a Tier 1 European piano in our North American climate/environment, I cannot say for sure, but I would venture a guess that under these same precise conditions, those European made Tier 1 pianos (whose manufactories have existed 50 or more years) would do just fine.

Although things are changing, it is a simple economic phenomena that shouldn't come as a surprise. A business should have a strong foothold on its domestic market. NY Steinway has enjoyed this in North America, and European piano makers have respectively enjoyed the same in Europe and surrounding regions. Where the scale tips, however, as has been pointed out.... is the fact that there is tremendously little interest by Europe and Europeans towards NY Steinways but there is definitely interest and appreciation by North Americans for various European pianos.
Our North American car makers have broken into the European auto market, I believe Bill Gates has had success with Windows based applications in Europe. So Europeans are interested in what we have to offer, but simply just not with regards to our pianos.
Hmph.....
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#2060120 - 04/06/13 12:13 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: carey]
Derulux Online   content
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/05
Posts: 5067
Loc: Philadelphia
Originally Posted By: carey
Originally Posted By: Thrill Science

And they have amazing brand recognition, even among non-musicians. When non-pianists come over and see the Bösendorfer in the living room, they often ask "how do these compare to Steinway" because that's the only high-end brand they know.

And what do you tell them???? smile

I usually say something like, "How does a Lamborghini compare to a Ferrari?"

They're both top-end precision instruments, but depending what you prefer, you may lean one way or the other. However, if you've never driven a car to the limit, and if you've never worked on cars a day in your life, chances are there are virtually no differences that you will be able to detect (except the hood ornament). wink
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#2060141 - 04/06/13 01:32 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
Frankni Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/12/13
Posts: 133
Loc: UK
Originally Posted By: Dwscamel
If these tier 1 pianos aren't found there, who actually buys them?


I am buying one -- a Sauter Delta is being built for me as we speak. I own two Yamaha grands, which have served me well, I must admit. But for me it was always Sauter I wanted to go for once I could afford it. So, this interest and expenditure is painstakingly built up over many years.

Having said that, indeed in the UK these instruments (or at least the grands) cannot, or only very rarely, be found anywhere. I have seen and played Steinways, Bosendorfers and Bluthners, but all these instruments (with the exception of Grotrian-Steinwegs maybe, but it was also many years ago I played one) I always found a little to very disappointing (a Schulze-Pollmann which I found really awful almost put me off the track of going for a higher-grade piano altogether). My mother has two Schimmel grands, but the bigger and newer one is not really to my taste (maybe needs voicing).
Coming back to Sauter:I knew about this brand only because I have seen and played them in my native country over 20 years ago, and recalled them as very fine instruments, in a more affordable bracket than what then counted as "tier 1" (however, at that time still unaffordable for me). But when I mentioned the name Sauter to my colleagues here in England (many of whom are competent players) I drew a total blank. I don't know how many there are in the UK, but I guess only a handful in private ownership. I asked about it when I visited Spaichingen in February, and it seems that the UK is indeed a difficult market. Those who are in the know about Sauter all either come from elsewhere or got their familiarity with the brand from ties with continental Europe.

So, looking at this forum, I think it is mostly the informed and discerning piano-lovers, those with a real passion for the subject (but not necessarily professionals) who have a keen interest in these instruments.


Edited by Frankni (04/06/13 09:01 AM)
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#2060147 - 04/06/13 01:43 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
Norbert Offline
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Quote:
So, looking at this forum, I think it is mostly the informed and discriminating piano-lovers, those with a real passion for the subject (but not necessarily professionals) who have a keen interest in these instruments.


Very true, we have three custom orders for Sauter grands right now. With possible fourth one, a 7' Sauter Omega being close contender for intermediate but highly regarded Concert Hall.

Excellence in every single detail: can it be a secret forever?

Norbert
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#2060178 - 04/06/13 04:26 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Furtwangler]
Frankni Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/12/13
Posts: 133
Loc: UK
Originally Posted By: Furtwangler
You want August Foerster? We give you August Foerster.


How about this:



I don't know who this kid is but he is fantastic.


Is it just me, or did this kid fastforward into an adult halfway through the performance? You really have to pay close attention otherwise time flies when you listen to some beautiful music.


Edited by Frankni (04/06/13 04:29 AM)
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Yamaha C3, Sauter Delta 185

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#2060182 - 04/06/13 04:43 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Frankni]
patH Online   content
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/09/13
Posts: 511
Loc: Germany
Originally Posted By: Frankni
Is it just me, or did this kid fastforward into an adult halfway through the performance? You really have to pay close attention otherwise time flies when you listen to some beautiful music.
Looks like they have a different soloist for each movement.

And the kid was great; but then I'm biased; I love Beethoven's first piano concerto in C-Major.
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#2060195 - 04/06/13 05:26 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
joe80 Offline
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Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 952
Frankini, Professional pianists are usually scared to venture outside the brands that they know. It's as simple as that. When I was studying, there was a culture amongst the staff and students to say that Steinway is the only piano worth performing on, Yamaha is a close second for practising, and everything else is not worth the wood it's made from. Including Bosendorfer, Bluthner, Fazioli, Schimmel, Grotrian, Seiler, Sauter, Kawai etc.

The truth of the matter here is that pianists often don't want to adapt their playing to the instrument that they're playing on, and therefore miss out on a whole host of colour and dynamic range that could be available to them. Finding out what is possible on one instrument allows you to transfer the intent at least, in some ways, to another.

Some of these lesser-known hand built instruments really sing. I've found with some Steinways and Yamahas, a little bit of a problem with getting the instrument to sing, in the two octaves above middle C. These same problems have not been apparent on Bluthners, and in particular, a Grotrian I played once was almost perfect. Yet these instruments are absent from conservatoires and concert venues in the UK. Why that is I have no idea, because they are fine hand built pianos, and they are significantly cheaper than Steinways.

Of course, I have played some absolutely beautiful Steinways too.

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#2060262 - 04/06/13 09:22 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: joe80]
Steve Cohen Offline
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Registered: 05/26/01
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Loc: Maryland/DC/No. VA
Originally Posted By: joe80

The truth of the matter here is that pianists often don't want to adapt their playing to the instrument that they're playing on, and therefore miss out on a whole host of colour and dynamic range that could be available to them. Finding out what is possible on one instrument allows you to transfer the intent at least, in some ways, to another.


Here, in a simple (excellent) paragraph, is the reason we should strive for diversity in music school pianos.
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#2060264 - 04/06/13 09:32 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: joe80]
pianoloverus Offline
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Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19097
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: joe80
Frankini, Professional pianists are usually scared to venture outside the brands that they know.
This seems perfectly reasonable if most of their experience is on a small number of makers.

Originally Posted By: joe80
The truth of the matter here is that pianists often don't want to adapt their playing to the instrument that they're playing on...
Again, it would seem that this is possible only if given enough time to practice on a particular piano.


Edited by pianoloverus (04/06/13 09:32 AM)

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#2060325 - 04/06/13 11:47 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Steve Cohen]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1252
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: Steve Cohen
Originally Posted By: joe80

The truth of the matter here is that pianists often don't want to adapt their playing to the instrument that they're playing on, and therefore miss out on a whole host of colour and dynamic range that could be available to them. Finding out what is possible on one instrument allows you to transfer the intent at least, in some ways, to another.


Here, in a simple (excellent) paragraph, is the reason we should strive for diversity in music school pianos.


I absolutely agree. From what I am aware of, there is a "culture of ignorance" being passed on by a whole generation of piano professors at major music schools. It is one of those "they don't know what they don't know" things. Even when there is the opportunity to try out a different instrument, those opportunities aren't taken because of pre-existing bias.

Steinway is a fine piano maker. But -- as I often put it -- "There are other flower in the garden". Concepts like the "All Steinway School" are, in fact, anti-learning. What students need to be exposed to is the full range of tools available for making fine piano performance. That full range does not begin and end with S&Sl
Diversity needs to come to the inventories of serious music schools.

In that regard, bravo to Julliard which just recently got a new Yamaha 9'. It's a baby step, but at least it's a step in the right direction.
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#2060330 - 04/06/13 11:56 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
AJF Offline
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Registered: 05/18/06
Posts: 1530
Loc: Toronto
Most music schools today (at least in Canada) don't have the resources to diversify
like you are suggesting. Music programs are a huge financial load on any institution because of the needed teacher to student ratio. A computer science program could easily have 5 faculty to 500 students. A music program needs 50 faculty to accomodate 500.
Many music programs today are being threatened because they aren't able to produce the same profit margins for there institutions as other programs.
We can all pontificate about the necessity of diversity in music schools but the reality is that many music programs today are far more concerned with their own continued survival than they are with contrasting their Steinway D with a Sauter Omega or Bluthner.


Edited by AJF (04/06/13 12:06 PM)

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#2060336 - 04/06/13 12:07 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
Dwscamel Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/22/13
Posts: 433
Oh, right, in all fairness: Yamaha's concert grands sound superb to me. I got a chance to hear a recording of a CF series grand and it was a real joy. I also suspect, but haven't heard with my own ears yet, that August Forster is a solid brand for the money.

And, of course, I think when any of us attend concerts, we're more concerned with the music and we don't even really consider what piano is being played.

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#2060348 - 04/06/13 12:42 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
Norbert Offline
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Registered: 07/03/01
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Loc: Surrey, B.C.
Quote:
The truth of the matter here is that pianists often don't want to adapt their playing to the instrument that they're playing on, and therefore miss out on a whole host of colour and dynamic range that could be available to them. Finding out what is possible on one instrument allows you to transfer the intent at least, in some ways, to another.


I know for a fact that in Germany this is the "law"

Companies are not allowed to "donate" their instruments to public conservatories for marketing purpose.

When several makers are being approached by colleges, they all make near wholesale offers - so going it can't be all based on "economics" to decide going with only one single brand supplying the whole college.

But one needs "interest' and willpower to do so - plus putting time in to allow this type diversity. And of course the pianos at display somewhere in local showrooms to get to know the different brands.

More headache than worth it perhaps for the average school administrator?

Norbert blush


Edited by Norbert (04/07/13 09:53 PM)
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#2060358 - 04/06/13 12:57 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: AJF]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1252
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: AJF
Most music schools today (at least in Canada) don't have the resources to diversify
like you are suggesting. Music programs are a huge financial load on any institution because of the needed teacher to student ratio. A computer science program could easily have 5 faculty to 500 students. A music program needs 50 faculty to accomodate 500.
Many music programs today are being threatened because they aren't able to produce the same profit margins for there institutions as other programs.
We can all pontificate about the necessity of diversity in music schools but the reality is that many music programs today are far more concerned with their own continued survival than they are with contrasting their Steinway D with a Sauter Omega or Bluthner.


The reality is that at some level pianos are still being purchased by music departments on an ongoing basis. There is no reason why those pianos need to be S&S.

The comparison to computer departments isn't entirely accurate. In 5 years a fine piano will still be a fine piano. In five years a state-of-the-art computer installation will be junk.
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Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

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#2060454 - 04/06/13 04:56 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
AJF Offline
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Registered: 05/18/06
Posts: 1530
Loc: Toronto
I'm not talking about hardware. I'm talking about the number of faculty members being paid by a program.
The thing that peeves me is that I've been teaching at a couple of post secondary institutions for 10 years and whenever a new piano is purchased they never consult the piano faculty. The guys buying pianos think a Steingraeber is a German beer...

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#2060457 - 04/06/13 05:05 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: newgeneration]
scriabinpiano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/28/07
Posts: 37
Originally Posted By: newgeneration

I tend to lean toward the side that Steinway today maintains its reputation more on marketing efforts then a current, modern attempt at continued development of its brand legacy.
Their last ditch attempt is to insist everything is fine, and they still see themselves in the mirror as the mighty giant they were 3 generations ago.

Where would Steinway be if Samick did not come to the rescue just a few years ago? Much of what made Steinway great a long time ago, as a leader in the industry, is non-existent today and it is ironic that Samick who only 10-15 years ago was seen as entry-level at best, is the company that saved the mighty Steinway.

We all are fully aware of the potential a Steinway can have once it is sold to a concert hall in North America and then proceeds to receive a phenomenal amount of technical work followed by years of regular, sometimes daily, servicing.

Hmph.....


Whatever...a great D is a great instrument, period.

Regarding daily servicing: my D is incredibly stable - I can't believe how little the tuning moves over a 6 month period and the voicing is rock stable. A key factor is I bought a top to bottom re-build from someone who really knew what they were doing.

I shopped pianos in the UK, New York, San Francisco and played everything I could find including both Hamburg & NY Ds, Steingraeber, Bosie, Bedchstein, Fazioli, Stuart, etc. etc.
I was focused mostly on the $45K-90K price range (a few years ago - I have not kept up with prices) and the NY D was, to my tastes, hands down the best I played in that range. It was actually toward the lower middle of that range and was a bargain.

Finally, I understand the jokes about tier 1s with "player pianos" etc. but I perform a lot and play pretty well (NPR recently aired a recording of one of my recitals).

So I agree there are a lot of great pianos and I wouldn't criticize someone buying whatever they want.
On the other hand, those of who who buy a Steinway D are not all fools being manipulated by some kind of marketing machine.

Your story about Samick is irrelevant...a lot of great piano companies have struggled financially while junk consumer goods products companies in many industries have flourished.

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#2060802 - 04/07/13 02:20 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
belsha Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/23/10
Posts: 48
Loc: Paris, France
In Europe, Fazioli's are becoming more and more frequent.

Boesendorfer's used to be quiet frequent too, in the from the late 1970's to the early 90's, but their quality really took a dip in the last decade or so, maybe they will see a ressurgence since their owned by Yamaha.

Blüthner's are great pianos, but they have a very peculiar sound which isn't everybody's liking, and they most certainly don't suit every repertoire, so it's quiet normal you don't see them in concert halls.

Bechstein also has ressurged as a brand more recently (in the last ten years), we do see them more and more, but again, for someomone who is used to the Steinway they can be a difficult adapation, more so than the Fazioli, for exemple.

Sauters and Grotrians are great pianos, but not quiet up to the level of Steinway/Bösen/Fazioli (though possibly better than NY Steinway).

Steingraebers are still very confidential, but I know some major festivals, like "La Roque d'Antheron" have them in their park.

So basically it boils down to Yamaha in small/cheap settings, and Steinway — and sometimes Boesen or Fazioli } in bigger, more prestigious settings. Thus you will mostly see either the smaller Yamahas (up to S6 or C7) or the full concert Model D Steinway or Bosen Imperial. No middle ground here (if they can't afford the D, they'll skip most likely the B and go for the much cheaper Yamaha).

It seems to me to be about predictability and price/performance. Yamahas and Steinway are predictable, no surprises, everybody knows how they sound and how to play them. You want a cheap piano, you take a Yamaha (ex CF), you can afford an expensive one, you get the Steinway. The other brands (ex. Boesen and Fazioli), fall somewhere in the middle, like Sauter or Grotrian, not as expensive as Steinway but not necessarily a lot better than a well-groomed Yamaha.
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#2061027 - 04/07/13 09:34 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: scriabinpiano]
newgeneration Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/04/09
Posts: 428
Loc: Richmond Hill, Ontario
Originally Posted By: scriabinpiano

Whatever...a great D is a great instrument, period.


You've hit the nail on the head precisely, .... 'a great D'.
What about the rest of the D's?

Originally Posted By: scriabinpiano


A key factor is I bought a top to bottom re-build from someone who really knew what they were doing.


I think this is a key factor indeed.
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#2061036 - 04/07/13 09:57 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
Norbert Offline
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Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 13965
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
Quote:
Sauters and Grotrians are great pianos, but not quiet up to the level of Steinway/Bösen/Fazioli (though possibly better than NY Steinway).



From my many visits to their factories, I strongly disagree with this. In fact these companies make often superior pianos - because they know they are the underdogs.

In Europe you can put any of the pianos side by side and have a heck of a time making a choice.

Quote:
The other brands (ex. Boesen and Fazioli), fall somewhere in the middle, like Sauter or Grotrian, not as expensive as Steinway but not necessarily a lot better than a well-groomed Yamaha.


This would only be said by someone who has not been exposed to a number of concert grands by these makers.

Admittedly this may fade or perhaps not be as relevant to the Hamburg Steinway, a truly fantastic piano, but definitely not in relation to the New York version.

Ever asked yourself why a good number of concert venues and private pianists insist on a "Hamburg" model, even on this continent?

An issue or question that doesn't even exist anywhere else in the world...

Norbert


Edited by Norbert (04/07/13 10:12 PM)
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#2061071 - 04/07/13 11:48 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: belsha]
master88er Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/15/07
Posts: 789
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Originally Posted By: belsha
In Europe, Fazioli's are becoming more and more frequent.

Boesendorfer's used to be quiet frequent too, in the from the late 1970's to the early 90's, but their quality really took a dip in the last decade or so, maybe they will see a ressurgence since their owned by Yamaha.

Blüthner's are great pianos, but they have a very peculiar sound which isn't everybody's liking, and they most certainly don't suit every repertoire, so it's quiet normal you don't see them in concert halls.

Bechstein also has ressurged as a brand more recently (in the last ten years), we do see them more and more, but again, for someomone who is used to the Steinway they can be a difficult adapation, more so than the Fazioli, for exemple.

Sauters and Grotrians are great pianos, but not quiet up to the level of Steinway/Bösen/Fazioli (though possibly better than NY Steinway).

Steingraebers are still very confidential, but I know some major festivals, like "La Roque d'Antheron" have them in their park.

So basically it boils down to Yamaha in small/cheap settings, and Steinway — and sometimes Boesen or Fazioli } in bigger, more prestigious settings. Thus you will mostly see either the smaller Yamahas (up to S6 or C7) or the full concert Model D Steinway or Bosen Imperial. No middle ground here (if they can't afford the D, they'll skip most likely the B and go for the much cheaper Yamaha).

It seems to me to be about predictability and price/performance. Yamahas and Steinway are predictable, no surprises, everybody knows how they sound and how to play them. You want a cheap piano, you take a Yamaha (ex CF), you can afford an expensive one, you get the Steinway. The other brands (ex. Boesen and Fazioli), fall somewhere in the middle, like Sauter or Grotrian, not as expensive as Steinway but not necessarily a lot better than a well-groomed Yamaha.


Utter hogwash. Perhaps you should take a look down the road at Paris Conservatory. Sauter is their official piano and there are more Sauters than any other brand at ths facility.
_________________________
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R.KASSMAN, Purveyor of Fine Pianos
Berkeley, CA

FORMER US Rep.for C.Bechstein

SF Area Dealer: SteingraeberGrotrianSauterEstoniaKayserburgBaldwinBrodmannRitmller
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#2061130 - 04/08/13 03:24 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Norbert]
lluiscl Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/10/06
Posts: 141
[/quote] Admittedly this may fade or perhaps not be as relevant to the Hamburg Steinway, a truly fantastic piano, but definitely not in relation to the New York version.

Ever asked yourself why a good number of concert venues and private pianists insist on a "Hamburg" model, even on this continent?


Norbert[/quote]

Certainly, as P.L. Aimard chose finally a Hamburg in his NY concert in "Note by Note" film (that tells us how to make a NY Steinway to perfection...).

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#2061209 - 04/08/13 10:07 AM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Dwscamel]
Plowboy Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/26/08
Posts: 2173
Loc: Huntington Beach, CA
How come Bob Snyder doesn't come on this forum and bad mouth his competition?
_________________________
Gary Schenk

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#2061255 - 04/08/13 12:06 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: lluiscl]
kpembrook Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/10
Posts: 1252
Loc: Michigan
Originally Posted By: lluiscl
[/quote] Admittedly this may fade or perhaps not be as relevant to the Hamburg Steinway, a truly fantastic piano, but definitely not in relation to the New York version.

Ever asked yourself why a good number of concert venues and private pianists insist on a "Hamburg" model, even on this continent?


Norbert

Certainly, as P.L. Aimard chose finally a Hamburg in his NY concert in "Note by Note" film (that tells us how to make a NY Steinway to perfection...).


And yet, I'm currently interacting with a concert pianist in South Africa who despises the Hamburg version which is mostly what's available in Africa and Europe and has a NY S&S "D" in his own home.


Edited by kpembrook (04/08/13 12:06 PM)
_________________________
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USA Distributor for Isaac Cadenza hammers and Profundo Bass Strings
Supporting Piano Owners D-I-Y piano tuning and repair

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#2061259 - 04/08/13 12:16 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: kpembrook]
Furtwangler Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 1474
Loc: Danville, California
Originally Posted By: kpembrook
Originally Posted By: lluiscl
Admittedly this may fade or perhaps not be as relevant to the Hamburg Steinway, a truly fantastic piano, but definitely not in relation to the New York version.

Ever asked yourself why a good number of concert venues and private pianists insist on a "Hamburg" model, even on this continent?


Norbert

Certainly, as P.L. Aimard chose finally a Hamburg in his NY concert in "Note by Note" film (that tells us how to make a NY Steinway to perfection...).


And yet, I'm currently interacting with a concert pianist in South Africa who despises the Hamburg version which is mostly what's available in Africa and Europe and has a NY S&S "D" in his own home. [/quote]

Be careful Keith. He may be mentally unstable.

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#2061262 - 04/08/13 12:17 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Plowboy]
Furtwangler Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 1474
Loc: Danville, California
Originally Posted By: Plowboy
How come Bob Snyder doesn't come on this forum and bad mouth his competition?


Probably 2 reasons:

1. Bob Snyder doesn't do that kind of thing.

2. Steinway dealers do enough bashing already.

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#2061277 - 04/08/13 01:11 PM Re: Why Aren't Tier 1 Pianos More Common? [Re: Furtwangler]
Plowboy Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/26/08
Posts: 2173
Loc: Huntington Beach, CA
Originally Posted By: Furtwangler


2. Steinway dealers do enough bashing already.


I don't recall that happening on the forum, but maybe I missed it.
_________________________
Gary Schenk

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